K-State Slate: 12.9.11
by TB on Dec 9, 2011 7:01 AM CST
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K-State Basketball
The Wildcats couldn't hold on to a second-half lead and lost, 85-80, in two overtimes to West Virginia in Wichita.
K-State Football
The awards keep rolling in, as Tyler Lockett (first-team KR) and Nigel Malone (second-team DB) were named to the Walter Camp All-America team.
Collin Klein (all-purpose) and Arthur Brown (linebacker) made the AP all-Big 12 team.
K-State Volleyball
K-State takes on Pepperdine in the regional semi-finals tonight at 9 p.m. We'll have an open thread up for that one.
KU hires Charlie Weis
In the face of universal ridicule from national football pundits, KU hired Charlie Weis as its next football coach. Yes, Charlie Weis, the architect of that 102nd-ranked Florida offense, is now the savior of KU football.
As a college head coach at Notre Dame, Weis was 35-27 in five seasons, or basically a 7-5 average. He took the Irish to two BCS bowls, but I kind of doubt KU gets a BCS bowl berth at 9-3 or 10-2 like Notre Dame does.
Pan summed it up pretty well on the thread yesterday. This is an easy hiring to mock for a lot of reasons, but given KU's situation right now, there are much worse hires it could have made.
College Football
I haven't had time to read this stuff yet, but here's Frank the Tank's look at the possible plus-one scenarios.
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I don't think KU could have made too many worse hires.
Weiss had top recruiting classes at ND and did not do well his last 2 years. For $3 million a year, there are many other OC’s and DC’s that I would hire before Weiss.
Maybe it will work out, but color me skeptical.
The time for calm and rational discourse is past, now is the time for senseless bickering -Anonymous the Younger
BOTC - Read the Adventures of the BigXII if you doubt our serious attitude towards sports.
by Anon_the_younger on Dec 9, 2011 8:52 AM CST reply actions
You saw what one of my KU friends (yes, I have them) said about that hire...
I’m not skeptical. KU is just downright delusional. Get me an ounce of what the’re smoking.
Oh, come on now. That's just stupid.
Twitter - @BigE_29er
I think those recruiting classes were a bit overrated.
Simply because it was Notre Dame getting those players.
I’m not convinced that Weis CAN recruit. That, for me, is his biggest question mark.
I think there is no doubt he can coach an offense. Notre Dame had pretty good offenses with Willingham’s players under Weiss.
Also, the Chiefs had a pretty good offense last year, all things considered. The Patriots were pretty good too, but I’m not going to give him too much credit for that (Brady et al).
As for Florida, that was just one year.
Not saying this is a home-run hire or anything, but I’ am not nearly as convinced as most people here that this is a horrible hire. At the very least it is going to be better than Turner Gill.
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Dec 9, 2011 9:10 AM CST up reply actions
Weiss's last three years at ND 3-9,7-6,6-6 (16-21).
Those are the seasons that probably have his recruits, which would be the upside for KU.
If his offense requires NFL players, those are rare at the college level (1 in 10 if you are lucky).
Saying he did well at KC is proof while his failure at FL isn’t, does not make sense. He was at each location for the same amount of time. The players at FL are much closer to the level of the players at KU.
If I was an AD, Weiss would not have been on my phone call list.
The time for calm and rational discourse is past, now is the time for senseless bickering -Anonymous the Younger
BOTC - Read the Adventures of the BigXII if you doubt our serious attitude towards sports.
by Anon_the_younger on Dec 9, 2011 9:46 AM CST up reply actions
Which is why I said that his big question mark is recruiting.
Conversely, saying his one bad year at Florida means he is a bad at coaching a college offense while ignoring the good offenses he fielded at Notre Dame over 5 years does not make much sense either.
As I said in my post, I’m not saying that Weiss is a great head coach. I’m saying he can coach offense for sure. There is a big question mark on his ability to recruit. I think it is reasonable to think that Weiss made a bunch of mistakes when transitioning from the NFL and that he didn’t anticipate how important/difficult recruiting was going to be. This would conceivably have been addressed in Zenger’s interview with Weiss. It is also reasonable to conclude that he could have learned from those mistakes and will be a better recruiter.
I agree, there is a greater amount of risk assumed when hiring Weiss than if they had gone in almost ay other direction. But that doesn’t in and of itself mean it is a bad hire.
My main point is that this is not a slam-dunk awful hire. It may end up being bad, but I don’t think you can reasonably look at the facts and conclude without a doubt that Weiss is going to fail miserably.
And that’s it, I’m done defending the decision. It makes me sick defending anything KU does.
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Dec 9, 2011 10:02 AM CST up reply actions
I'm on board somewhat with you here, Chris
in regards to the blurriness of his recruiting. It is questionable just how great those (highly-ranked) recruiting classes Weis got at Notre Dame were in actuality. Conversely, those classes may have indeed been as talented as their lofty rankings but Weis and his staff failed (utterly) in developing them and maximizing their talents.
But make no mistake, recruiting for ND is a hell of a lot different than recruiting for KU. That much goes without saying.
Now you have a coach with a New Jersey attitude who has zero recruiting ties to Texas, who hasn’t exactly set the world on fire at the collegiate level (to put it mildly), whose teams faded late in games at Notre Dame and who managed to lose a game as a 19-point favorite – at home, on Senior Day – to a Greg Robinson-coached Syracuse team…with a 13-point lead in the 4th quarter (this latter aspect is a near-impossibility for anyone, even Ron Prince, to accomplish).
KU defender, clarinet player, wonder what's next?
I’ll just leave off now and quite possibly tell you in a couple of years “I told you so.”
The time for calm and rational discourse is past, now is the time for senseless bickering -Anonymous the Younger
BOTC - Read the Adventures of the BigXII if you doubt our serious attitude towards sports.
by Anon_the_younger on Dec 9, 2011 3:16 PM CST up reply actions
I was in the upper section for last nights game, but I am far more upset with the officials than the team or coaches for the loss.
I would have sworn that Hightower was there because in the second half they simply would not let either team play basketball. If I can remember, both teams were in the double bonus with 11:30 left in the game – it was crazy. The entire second half there was no flow to the game….I was really disapointed with the officials.
And H&R Block should not be on the perimiter when your up by 3 at the end of the game…how are we not guarding 35’ from the basket at that point?
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
Not to start a fight here (seriously)
but aren’t you guys used to this yet with Frank’s teams? They play rough, physical basketball.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
Rock Chalk Talk
I can't speak for everyone
But I think the complaint from yesterday is that the second half was called much more tightly than the first, and a lot of the whistles seemed to be really inconsistent. The numbers back it up: 19 combined fouls in the 1st half, then 32 in the second half.
I don’t think anybody is saying K-State lost this game because of the referees — the only egregious call in favor of WVU was the pivotal charge call on Jamar that even the announcers thought was bad. We’re just disappointed because despite all of the sloppiness and missed layups, the first half was by and large more fun to watch than the second half, when the whistles didn’t let anybody get into a rhythm at all, like mac attack said.
This.
It wasn’t biased officiating against KSU. It just was officials taking too much control of the game.
Everyone says the players need to adapt to the refs. Well, one would hope the refs might have some reasonable expectations coming into specific games. They should know how WVU and KSU play and made a consistent effort to let it be physical.
Thanks to both of you for clearing it up, I didn't watch last night but know what you mean.
As an official, I know it happens and I’ve been guilty of it too. We want the game to flow well but sometimes the physical play that is borderline in the first half continues to escalate with each minute. Blowing the whistle is about the only way to keep it from getting out of control.
I’m not sticking up for them, just offering a different side.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
Rock Chalk Talk
1st half was not called too strigently but the 2nd half had touch fouls called.
Even after the players started backing off, they continued to call touch fouls.
The time for calm and rational discourse is past, now is the time for senseless bickering -Anonymous the Younger
BOTC - Read the Adventures of the BigXII if you doubt our serious attitude towards sports.
by Anon_the_younger on Dec 9, 2011 3:14 PM CST up reply actions
Thanks for explaining my earlier commets so well guys...
we didn’t lose because of referees as they called the game the same both ways, it was just much more stringent in the second half and it took both teams out of flow.
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
by mac attack ict on Dec 9, 2011 3:45 PM CST up reply actions
You forgot to mention the nearly silent whistles in OT. Both the first and second.
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
Guys at work and I debated this morning
on whether or not we should have fouled when they were coming up the court. I say yes, but who knows. What would you guys have done in that situation?
Absolutely not
There was way too much time left. About 15 seconds, if I remember right. The announcers were even saying that WVU had time to go for a 2, and the way K-State shoots free throws, fouling would have been a really risky proposition.
by Ahearn Alley on Dec 9, 2011 10:01 AM CST up reply actions
I generally don't like mocking Frank's anger
But when it’s done by putting his nationally televised F-bomb in slow motion to The Mountain Goats’ “Have To Explode,” I have to give some credit to Deadspin. I imagine few of you will appreciate this as much as me and MrHappyMushroom, but I thought it was worth sharing. At least it was one thing that made me smile from that miserable game.
That's funny.
And Angel’s getting blasted because he was four feet from the bucket, and just stood there and watched as the rebound came off.
Oh, come on now. That's just stupid.
Twitter - @BigE_29er
He was completely out of position
and never really tried for the board. I was pissed at him too at that moment
OK, this is hilarious, and I had to share.
From Belegcam over at rockmnation:
Step 1: Hire fat coach
Step 2: ???
Step 3: PROFIT!
by Belegcam on Dec 8, 2011 4:50 PM CST reply actions 6 recs
Would you like some Freys with that?
That's great!
The KU fans I know basically just ignore #2; think they’re blessed enough that you can skip that step.
Oh, come on now. That's just stupid.
Twitter - @BigE_29er
I like this hire by KU
I think Weis will be 6-6, 7-5 year in and year out. That’s right where I want KU. Good enough to keep an average coach around that won’t be a pain in our ass. Unless we hire Prince (or someone like him) back. Then we’re screwed.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Fight till Hell freezes over and then fight them on the ice.
by BlackCats on Dec 9, 2011 11:39 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
He has a wildcard amount of potential
Like he could go 6-6 in year one. I don’t see that happening, but I think he COULD pull that off. He feels like a peak season would be 8-4. I don’t see him accomplishing any more than Mangino did in 6 years other than maybe a few more wins (I think Mangino was like 50-48 there, I could see Weiss with a ceiling of like 53-45).
The hire isn’t a home run (which I obviously like), but solid given their state of their program. Smart move on their part, plus what was one of their objectives? To be better than Gil. Problem solved.
But you said it well BlackCats I think it’s perfect for KSU to likely be able to beat them for years to come. I would say I could see Weis being good enough to win 1 out of every 5 tries vs KSU…home win for them of course. Of course that’s vs Bill…get a Ron Prince back in here and ughh…
"Nor yet in Dell?"
We'll take it.
Maybe steal a game here and there from a better team and I’ll be thrilled.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
Rock Chalk Talk
Word that Crist may transfer to KU to reunite with Weis.
Would be a good pickup for them at QB.
I dunno, something about the similar level of mocking the Frank and Snyder 2.0 hires received makes me think this might work out for KU.
I'm cautiously optimistic that it won't work out.
But wouldn’t be surprised if it did.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Fight till Hell freezes over and then fight them on the ice.
Let KU get Crist
what difference will it make? Crist can’t play defense.
Could help with recruiting.
He’ll be able to tell skill position players they’ll have a good QB to throw to them. And in turn with good offensive recruiting could lead to convincing good defenders to join the momentum.
Grasping at straws here.
Crist or no Crist
I don’t see them elevating in 1 year (all that Crist has for eligibility) beyond 6-6. All their athletes are RBs (and maybe 1 TE), so unless they run a triple option or move some guys to WR, what can Crist really do there? Without looking at their schedule or knowing who’s returning elsewhere in the Big 12 (like RG3), I would guess a 4 win team for them.
"Nor yet in Dell?"
Yes, but that would make him a KU god.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Fight till Hell freezes over and then fight them on the ice.
I'm aware of that, an fine with that. Just saying...
Don’t fear this guy coming in for 1 year. If there was a way they could get this guy coming in a year from now where they’re trying to build off of a 4 win season I might “worry” some…there won’t be enough around this Crist to do jack squat.
"Nor yet in Dell?"
I was talking about the Weis hire...
Poor reply management on my behalf.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Fight till Hell freezes over and then fight them on the ice.
My thoughts exactly. Are you a lost twin or something BlackCats?
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
by mac attack ict on Dec 9, 2011 3:47 PM CST up reply actions
I don't know that it has been said yet, but in anticipation of tomorrow's game...
FEAR THE GOAT!!!!
GO NAVY!! BEAT ARMY!!
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Fight till Hell freezes over and then fight them on the ice.
by BlackCats on Dec 9, 2011 12:44 PM CST reply actions 2 recs
I will probably watch some...just because I always do in desperation
But I bet if I went up the road 20miles from Tongie to Leavenworth I know I could find a bar or two with people in there that are actually INTO the game.
"Nor yet in Dell?"
An autorec for you from my father.
He’s a Navy man.
I pull for the Midshipmen, but not with much passion or emotional investment.
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Dec 9, 2011 12:55 PM CST up reply actions
Love the Army-Navy game
So I’ll throw a rec up, as well. I try to make it over to West Point for at least one game a year. Best place to see a college football game in the country.
Always a good game but as 27 year Air Force veteran..."GO FALCONS"....
the defending Commander-in-Chief Trophy champs!!!
Booo
You know why I will always root for Navy (besides getting into Annapolis and then being a stupid 18yo)?
The Coast Guard. The most successful branch of the military. 221 years and they have never lost a coast.
They know where every single one of them is.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Fight till Hell freezes over and then fight them on the ice.
by BlackCats on Dec 9, 2011 2:48 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Coasters?
"If you don't want to work, become a reporter. That awful power, the public opinion of the nation, was created by a horde of self-complacent simpletons who failed at ditch digging and shoemaking and fetched up journalism on their way to the poorhouse." - Mark Twain
BOYCOTT ESPN!
Never mind - no twin of mine would root for Navy
I’m an Army vet through and through…
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
by mac attack ict on Dec 9, 2011 3:48 PM CST up reply actions
Quiter
Navy men don’t retire. They just sail away.
And thank you for your service.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Fight till Hell freezes over and then fight them on the ice.
You mean seamen just sail away.
Go Black Knights!
"If you don't want to work, become a reporter. That awful power, the public opinion of the nation, was created by a horde of self-complacent simpletons who failed at ditch digging and shoemaking and fetched up journalism on their way to the poorhouse." - Mark Twain
BOYCOTT ESPN!
I was trying to avoid the inevitable jokes.
It’s just too easy.
Fear the Goat!
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Fight till Hell freezes over and then fight them on the ice.
I haven't read the plus one scenarios article yet, but...
I have been contemplating doing a fan post on my take on it.
Now personally I don’t think plus 1 is that great. And we all have our own opinions as to “what CFB needs” to fix it. The reality is, none of us know which scenario is the better of the many as we can
‘t just lay ’em out and play ’em out for years against each other to determine that. But, since we all can agree on we need a better system to give more teams a chance to not have multiple teams finish a season with undefeated records and only be able to crown 1 a champion…I think as fans we need to try and focus our efforts onto this plus 1 model as it seems to have some traction amongst those higher up. If we could set aside our egos for a second why our version of a playoff is better than another, and support the plus 1 it might help make it a reality. Yea I know it’s not in our hands necessarily, but every little bit helps.
So I just encourage those of us in favor of more than 2 teams having a shot at the title to start supporting the plus one.
"Nor yet in Dell?"
Ok read the proposed plus one plans article now
Mine’s probably somewhere between #1 and #2…will bake up later sometime this weekend (Sunday perhaps?)
- doesn’t look like it would solve anything, as it would just be an extension of the “regular season” and would not set out to eliminate multiple undefeated teams. If #1, #2 and #3 were all conference champions of different conferences they could all win their games and there could still be a chance 1 team couldn’t play in that second game.
"Nor yet in Dell?"
The plus one is like putting lipstick on a pig.
The time for calm and rational discourse is past, now is the time for senseless bickering -Anonymous the Younger
BOTC - Read the Adventures of the BigXII if you doubt our serious attitude towards sports.
by Anon_the_younger on Dec 9, 2011 3:15 PM CST up reply actions
yea, but I think it's like the snowball affect.
It’s what gets us to 8 (my favor), 12 or 16 faster.
"Nor yet in Dell?"
Big News for Baylor
They appear to have offered Briles a contract extension.
I think the both of them realize they can have a relationship for many many years. Briles’ knows he could easily go elsewhere and flame out easily. Why not be the guy who takes the Bears to unprecedented levels in the Big12. Even if he ends up being like Schiano at Rutgers, I think it’s a good way to have stability and keep from moving around the country so many times.
I want to say I’m happy for Baylor, but the last time I said something (albeit mentally to myself at the time) it totally backfired in my face.
"Nor yet in Dell?"
When was that last time?
Do you mean it backfired in the sense that it ended up being bad for Baylor?
Or do you mean that your condescending sneer resulted in Baylor being good/KSU getting bad karma payback?
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Dec 9, 2011 6:44 PM CST up reply actions
no in 1999, not knowing OU's rich tradition...
I cheered for them in the Independence bowl since they didn’t go to a bowl for a stretch of years at the time…little did I know. So while I’m happy for Baylor, I don’t need them to get TOO good.
"Nor yet in Dell?"
Maybe 1997 had it right? I still prefer 12 game seasons over 11, but other than that, I love this list
http://www.presnapread.com/alright-so-what-if-it-was-1997-not-2011/
"If you don't want to work, become a reporter. That awful power, the public opinion of the nation, was created by a horde of self-complacent simpletons who failed at ditch digging and shoemaking and fetched up journalism on their way to the poorhouse." - Mark Twain
BOYCOTT ESPN!
I like this site!
http://www.presnapread.com/bill-snyder-national-coach-of-the-year/
"If you don't want to work, become a reporter. That awful power, the public opinion of the nation, was created by a horde of self-complacent simpletons who failed at ditch digging and shoemaking and fetched up journalism on their way to the poorhouse." - Mark Twain
BOYCOTT ESPN!
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