The Big 12 holds off on adding West Virginia, and is therefore unstable
by TB on Oct 27, 2011 10:00 AM CDT
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PrintLet me get this straight.
Unsourced reports on Tuesday indicated that the Big 12 was close to adding West Virginia University. Yesterday, we heard that announcement was not going to happen and the process was ongoing (see also here for the ESPN/Joe Schad version), and saw more unsourced reports that Louisville may be added to the Big 12 rather than WVU. Then a couple U.S. Congressmen from West Virginia got involved, calling for an investigation to see if anything improper had occurred.
And through all this misdirection and anonymity, we're supposed to be able to draw any conclusions at all?
Yes, apparently, according to some. Sam Mellinger essentially agreed on Twitter with someone who called the Big 12 a clown show, and then when I asked for an explanation could do no better than "the Big 12 is a mess" and that this turn of events proves Missouri's point that the Big 12 is unstable. Granted, it's Twitter, which doesn't leave much room for explanations, but this is just one example. Anyone who listened to 810 this morning heard Steven St. John nearly have a coronary because he was so aghast at the cat-herding show that passes for the Big 12 Conference.
Really? I thought instability was predicated on the possibility that schools would leave the conference. In this instance, we have completely unsourced reports (I really can't stress that enough) that schools are stabbing each other in the back to get into this conference. Look, we've already been through this. Apparently, Oklahoma and Texas looked around, and they found that nobody wants them, for one reason or another. Nobody is leaving the conference right now, except for Missouri.
What we're left with is the empty assertion that, because all conference members don't agree on a course of action the conference is inherently unstable and leaderless. Does that mean the SEC is unstable because not every single one of its members agrees that adding Missouri is a good idea? Of course not. That's laughable. But when the conference is the Big 12, and completely unsourced reports indicate that it is going to add West Virginia, and then completely unsourced reports indicate that its expansion process is on hold, and the only actual, named sources are U.S. Congressmen from West Virginia who are calling for an investigation to see if anything "inappropriate or unethical" was done to interfere with a decision made by the Big 12 Conference, that is clear and convincing proof that the Big 12 is unstable.
If we assume that the unsourced reports are correct and David Boren is lobbying on behalf of Louisville as a favor to his buddy Mitch McConnell, and as a result of that hijacking what was otherwise a done deal, then I can agree that Boren needs to go about his work a bit more discreetly. There's no reason we can't add both schools, if Oklahoma would be willing to budge on its (apparent, and ridiculous) position that we should only go to 10 schools. But even given that, I fail to see how Boren's actions are an indication that the Big 12 is unstable.
In any event, the important steps toward stability have been taken. Earlier this week, the Big 12 board of directors reaffirmed its commitment to a grant of rights for Tier 1 and Tier 2 media rights, and the conference has already agreed to equal sharing of Tier 1 and Tier 2 revenue. This is just another knee-jerk reaction by the media and another scapegoat for Missouri.
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i can't rec this enough.
You said exactly what i’ve been thinking the past day. The DeArmond fanboys couldn’t get enough of it.
Anything the Big 12 does is proof of it's instability.
Duh.
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Oct 27, 2011 10:06 AM CDT reply actions
Holy shit
Boren just farted. INSTABLILITYE
Hail to the Purple, Hail to the White
Wildcat in spirit, Wildcat in fight
Hail Alma Mater from sea to sea
Onward forever, Hail Victory!
Apparently muliple exclamation points are not welcome here.
;)
Hail to the Purple, Hail to the White
Wildcat in spirit, Wildcat in fight
Hail Alma Mater from sea to sea
Onward forever, Hail Victory!
Frankly
I’ll never understand why people think a 10-team league is a benefit over a 12-team league. That added championship game, while a major pain in the buttocks is also a ticket to the BCS title game in most years. Win that and suddenly a one-loss Big 12 team looks much more appealing to the masses. Personally I want 12 teams again and wouldn’t argue very long against the conference being proactive and being the first to jump to 16.
I guess I just don’t understand why the position has to be Louisville OR WVU. Why not both? I know my downfall there is my liking of 12 teams, yet it only makes sense. They both want in, that defaults us to 12 teams. Missouri stays and BINGO! We’ve got 12. They bail and we get one more.
If Oklahoma is arguing against a 12 team league…they are retarded. 12 teams is in the best interest (IMO) of everyone in this conference.
I do have to say that seeing that Big 12 line run across the crawler on ESPN is kind of embarrassing though. Just makes me feel like the conference cannot get any ducks in any semblance of a row.
Recd
You sir are spot on
Add both, if Mizzou stays, we’re at 12 and the geography makes some sence. We also go teams to draw from if we want to go to 14 or 16.
I’m back to the kick ut’s ass out. Chuck is looking like a Beebe
I like my 10 because of the perfect round-robin schedule for all sports
But that’s the only reason.
"If you don't want to work, become a reporter. That awful power, the public opinion of the nation, was created by a horde of self-complacent simpletons who failed at ditch digging and shoemaking and fetched up journalism on their way to the poorhouse." - Mark Twain
I too
like that aspect of it. But as far as the national perception is concerned, it really, REALLY hurts the Big 12. I think the 12 teams, while a bit unwieldy in that we can’t all play each other all the time, is the option that makes the most sense for everyone.
I'm with you ...
I wish the real world currently worked for 10 schools. I like true conference champions decided by regular seasons with home/away symmetry.
by Itchy n Scratchy on Oct 27, 2011 1:45 PM CDT up reply actions
I think 8 10 team conferences is much better than 4 16 team conferences....
4 superconferneces is simply 8 eight team conferences under a different name…8 seperate 10 team conferences is a much better scenario.
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
by mac attack ict on Oct 27, 2011 3:00 PM CDT up reply actions
My understanding is...
That OU wants 12, UT does not. UT wants WVU and 6 yr waiver of rights. OU wants Louisville and 10 yr waiver of rights. Now they are trying to come to some sort of mutual agreement. Also, it seems, that most of the old north along with OSU and one of the Texas schools wants 12 again. I read somewhere though that Patterson at TCU likes 10. Its all a crap shoot really.
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
OU wants 12...
Isn’t it possible that WVU and a co-conspirator in the Big 12 – one that loves to spin the media – leaked the story about WVU having a Big 12 invite to force the league to hold at 10 teams?
by Blatant Homerism on Oct 27, 2011 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions
No
A press conference was booked. Travel plans were set to bring Big 12 officials to Morgantown. These were all cancelled last minute.
WVU wants to be in a conference with a championship game, ultimately.
"that place (West Virginia) laid the foundation for who I am. A lot of outsiders make fun of it and say negative things about West Virginia. Fuck them" - Jerry West
by MountaineerAirman on Oct 27, 2011 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions
I think most of us would like a championship game as well.
Oh, to be a fly on the wall during a Big 12 Board of Directors meeting.
Hail to the Purple, Hail to the White
Wildcat in spirit, Wildcat in fight
Hail Alma Mater from sea to sea
Onward forever, Hail Victory!
If only.
"that place (West Virginia) laid the foundation for who I am. A lot of outsiders make fun of it and say negative things about West Virginia. Fuck them" - Jerry West
by MountaineerAirman on Oct 27, 2011 10:33 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't want to be a fly on the wall.
I want to address them.
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I GOTS IDEAS. LOTS OF EM.
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@PJ_BOTC - My Twitter
Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
Would it be inappropriate to "address" them
while armed, with several other paramilitary types backing me up?
I mean, I don’t want to be RUDE to them or anything.
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1) When did you become a Central American dictator?
2) Can we all have matching berets but unmatched fatigues?
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@PJ_BOTC - My Twitter
Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
I was actually more envisioning a Hans Gruber sort of thing.
Only, you know, without that pesky John McClane problem.
As such, I was figuring we’d all be in basic black. Complete with turtlenecks.
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"I am Jon of Morse, and I am here to make you listen to my proposals on college football, ya?"
“LET US DANCE!”
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
Aw, man, I'm like a foot taller than that midget.
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I think WVU was looking for a soft place to land and got DeLossed.
I’m just speculating, but I think the conference agreed to the ‘duh’ candidate and then realized that if they went ahead and offered them right now, Texas was going to spend forever sitting on it’s butt, with it’s hands over it’s ears, making a spitting noise while we tried to convince them that a twelve team model was a good idea.
While I believe the conference is stable, I believe it’s stable because Texas is so hard to deal with. I don’t want to vilify them because they’re honest about being horrible to deal with, but it doesn’t change the fact that they’re about as fun to have around as a bad college roommate.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
That's Texas to a 'T'
Drinking your last beer, eating all your peanut butter, and then sitting bare assed on YOUR mattress with a dumbfounded look on their face like “What?”
Don't forget eating all of the well-marked boxes of Pizza Rolls.
"An invasion of armies can be resisted, but not an idea whose time has come." *Victor Hugo*
But we BOUGHT the beer, dammit.
Did we drink some of your allotment? Yeah, but still…
by mnHorn on Oct 27, 2011 2:05 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
STILL bashing UT?
lThe story was UT wanted WVU – land thieves wanted Louisville. Welcoming committe was to travel to Morgantown for announcement Wed.
KY dipshit senator visited Land thieves – Boren AND Okie Lite owner (Pickens) cooled on WVU and warmed on Louie. Texas not invloved in this little charade at all.
But you STILL are busting UT’s balls? You sure you aren’t an aggy?
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
by Snide Aside on Oct 27, 2011 10:48 PM CDT up reply actions
Hey, I haven't been the main one. Overall, I've been a defender of UT in this process because they haven't hidden who they are. This is just what I believe.
The fact that UT wants ten teams is an embarrassment, and they should be ashamed of themselves. I don’t care if we split the divisions so OU and UT can be separated. We need to get back to twelve, and any school that’s against it should be called out.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
But your comment was that WVU got "Delossed".
Please provide a link as to how that came about and what it even means. Particularly, since UT is the main advocate of WVU joing the conference.
It is true that Dodds likes the 10 team format and the thieves like the 12 team. Interesting about the thieves since they were for so long in the Big Eight, but now want 12.
I personally prefer the 12 team myself, but the only argument I can see for this format is to just provide another revenue game. I assume this would be your justification?
Not that I think it will happen anytime soon, but what if the BCS actually went away and we had a playoff system – what then for the inter-conference CCV game? And now we have 12 instead of 10 teams?
.
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
by Snide Aside on Oct 27, 2011 11:17 PM CDT up reply actions
It's just stability.
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 27, 2011 11:52 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm just replying to this
Because you have been missed Spider_Monkey
Bobby Hill: What's a meat examination team?
Hank Hill: It's like a debate team, only instead of doing something useless you get to grade the cut and quality of meat!
thanks MeatGeek. Here's a Crown on the rocks for ya. I've been lurking but had to hold my tongue.
Missed chatting with you guys. Maybe this crap will be over soon and we can get back to hating KU together.
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 2:06 AM CDT up reply actions
Maybe someday...
It’ll take a while if and when this move to the SEC thing takes place. But I believe we can be united once more, if only to share KU hatred. That will suffice.
Bobby Hill: What's a meat examination team?
Hank Hill: It's like a debate team, only instead of doing something useless you get to grade the cut and quality of meat!
we will always have that: ku hatred.
“We had joy we had fun we had moments in the sun…”
and just in case it’s the last opportunity:
ROLL GODDAMNED TIRE!
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 2:12 AM CDT up reply actions
Till Gabriel's horn blows....
Bobby Hill: What's a meat examination team?
Hank Hill: It's like a debate team, only instead of doing something useless you get to grade the cut and quality of meat!
Spider Monkey!
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Oct 28, 2011 9:28 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
divisions help teams that aren't a national power every year
For OU and Texas, it’s just an additional game. For everyone else in the conference, it helps in a lot of different ways.
I think what Pan was getting at is that WVU would be in the league right now if there was agreement to go to 12, and Texas seems to be the one blocking that. That’s my impression anyway, i won’t speak for him.
I can somewhat see this
You are saying that, in case you lose a couple during the season, a playoff gives you a “:second chance” to win the title?
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
I think it's more a case of it giving you a better chance to win A title.
No, a division title is not a conference title, but it’s still an accomplishment and something you can point to. For all that Iowa State gets mocked, they can actually say “Hey, we shared a couple of Big 12 North titles,” even though they came up short in the tiebreakers and didn’t get to go to the CCG.
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Well
Plus you have years like 2003. KSU to BCS and OU to CCG.
While I think if OSU or KSU remain undefeated we will have one in CCG and a BCS game, if we lose to OU and beat OSU the B12 probably only gets one BCS game. That’s a lot of money.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
I'm not a fan of this, myself.
A team could be 4-6 and win a division “title”. To me this smacks of the little league credo of giving every team member a trophy just because they participated.
It makes more sense and has more merit to have one more opportunity to win the Conference title – plus a frew more coins for the participating schools.
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
by Snide Aside on Oct 28, 2011 10:22 PM CDT up reply actions
I look at it as providing more incentive.
A team that may be out of the “Conference Title Race” could still have a shot at the divisional title. Therefore they are more likely to show up when playing their divisional top-dogs, forcing the best teams to always be on guard or risk a loss.
Now, they definitely always have to be on guard now, but apart from a bowl game, what else does a team like Missouri have to play for now? If they still had a shot at a divisional title (and therefore conference title) don’t you think they would probably be a more dangerous team?
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Oct 28, 2011 10:50 PM CDT up reply actions
.
credo of giving every team member a trophy just because they participated.
Sounds like ku football.
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 29, 2011 5:48 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't know why Patterson has any say in this at this point.
I think the trade off between 10 and 12 schools is:
1.) Will media deals be reworked for 12 schools? The pie we are trying to keep is considerable when split between 10 more so than 12.
2.) Conference championship game: Could this make up the difference with adding 2 more schools?
3.) Competition and the possibility of ruining a teams shot at a BCS game: round-robin works well for perennial powers like Oklahoma and Texas that can power through their schedule without fear of being upset in the CCG. Then again, round-robin also means that conference parity can lead to national perception of weakness. Divisional play allows for a generally weaker football school to upset a power and make it into a BCS game.
Hail to the Purple, Hail to the White
Wildcat in spirit, Wildcat in fight
Hail Alma Mater from sea to sea
Onward forever, Hail Victory!
Here's what I've heard and have pieced together...
OU wants 12.
Texas wants 10. Texas wants WVU to be the final addition.
OU, in an effort to force all supporters of the 10-team model to capitulate and go to twelve, are trying to jam Louisville in as the tenth member so the most attractive “free agent”, West Virginia, is a “must take” as well, forcing us to immediately go to 12 teams (which we will be at until Mizzou officially leaves).
At that point, once Missouri leaves, we get creative on #12 with Brigham Dame or Cincy, but we can take our time with it.
I think I’ve summed that up efficiently.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
This is close to what I've heard...
One variation is that the WVU news got leaked by the advocates of the 10-team scenario to back the advocates of a 12-team league into a corner, the thought being that the schools in favor of 12 teams wouldn’t want the PR disaster if a situation like the one that is currently playing out occurred.
This keeps getting painted as a Louisville-West Virginia battle in the media, but it sounds like it’s more about having 10 teams versus having 12 teams.
by Blatant Homerism on Oct 27, 2011 11:04 AM CDT up reply actions
Anyone in this conference that wants ten teams should be beaten with sticks for being a big ol' dummy.
That includes the KSU delegation if they are a part of it.
(But I’ve been told they are not.)
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
Tell the Big 12 BoD to go outside and fetch a twig off the tree.
Hail to the Purple, Hail to the White
Wildcat in spirit, Wildcat in fight
Hail Alma Mater from sea to sea
Onward forever, Hail Victory!
Don't get me wrong, in the current environment 12 to 16 team confernences are what you need to survive...
but I still think if you were starting from scratch, and wanted to build a playoff / regionally supportive conference system that 8 10 team conferences would be ideal. Especially for football as well as basketball selection.
Pan, you know its true…it may not be feasable, but it would be better.
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
by mac attack ict on Oct 27, 2011 3:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes, it would absolutely be better starting from scratch.
Unfortunately, we’re not, and neither the SEC, Big 10, or Pac-12 is going to evict two members.
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maybe once we build up to 16 team conferences
the divisions will eventually be the functional equivalent of 8 team conferences. And the CCG’s will be the functional equivalent of what the BCS bowls are now. Instead of being like Big 12 champ v. Pac 10 champ it will just be Big 12 north champ v. big 12 south champ. The difference is with 8 team divisions it is more like a current day bowl game and less like a conference championship because the divisions don’t really play each other during the year. Then if there are still bowl games they will be more like the next round of a tournament after the CCG’s. Then we might as well play the winners of those games against each other until we have a true national champion.
This is a crazy stream of consciousness and not what I set out to write. I thought about just deleting it but I went through the trouble to write it so posting it. This is what happens when you don’t have school on Fridays and start drinking right after school on Thursdays. 0.o
Petro and Kerkhoff are currently playing checkers regarding this discussion right now on 810 ...
The 10 vs 12 strategery is apparently beyond them.
by Itchy n Scratchy on Oct 27, 2011 11:12 AM CDT up reply actions
Soren Petro has mastered the art of beating a subject to death without ever actually knowing what he's talking about.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
by Panjandrum on Oct 27, 2011 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
rec worthy
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
by mac attack ict on Oct 27, 2011 3:16 PM CDT up reply actions
so there's hope for me in sports radio?
The time for calm and rational discourse is past, now is the time for senseless bickering -Anonymous the Younger
BOTC - Read the Adventures of the BigXII if you doubt our serious attitude towards sports.
by Anon_the_younger on Oct 27, 2011 4:08 PM CDT up reply actions
If Soran Petro can find a spot there,
there’s hope for ALL of us, Anon.
"An invasion of armies can be resisted, but not an idea whose time has come." *Victor Hugo*
This makes perfect sense to me - the entire state of Oklahoma sucks!
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
by Snide Aside on Oct 27, 2011 10:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Hey, now.
I have it on good authority that one point five acres of Oklahoma is friggin’ AWESOME.
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The current psyche of Mizzou Nation is such that ...
if David Boren says he likes chunky peanut butter and DeLoss Dodds says he likes creamy peanut butter … that will vault to the top of Mizzou’s “Reason to Leave” list.
by Itchy n Scratchy on Oct 27, 2011 10:20 AM CDT reply actions 8 recs
In all fairness, they're being fed information from two main sources..
Mike DeArmond in KC, who is the most unprofessional and blatant homer I’ve ever seen in print journalism and has Butthurtitis more than the worst Message Board fan…
Gabe DeArmond, who is a sardonic, caustic twit that got his smarts and professionalism from his father…
And a bunch of nerds in St. Louis who only care about St. Louis and really could care less about Missouri, so whatever information they give them is probably half informed at best.
I’m not a person who will do cartwheels over the kind of representation we get in the print media (though I do love Rob Cassidy, Austin Meek, and Friend of BOTC, Curtis Kitchen), but none of the above are really overly blatant in their homerism of Kansas State and are generally level-headed and realistic in their observations.
Mizzou fans don’t have the necessary check and balance system of someone in the media telling them that they need to temper their fervor. Their fervor is coming from the media. The lines between the third and fourth estate for Mizzou are so gray that they are essentially one in the same. There is no differentiation between fan and media for Mizzou because all of their media are fans. It makes for a very strange and unhealthy dynamic, and it’s partially what’s pushing them to make a silly decision.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
How did you know? Mizzou likes peanut butter AND chocolate!!!
Mizzou is interfering with WVU and L’ville, didn’t you hear?
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 27, 2011 11:54 PM CDT up reply actions
Actually you are, and have been since you started talking about leaving the B12
The whole country is basically waiting on you guys to make your move, and Louisville/WVU are the 2 schools right in the middle of it all.
"You got your peanut butter in my chocolate!" ; "You got your chocolate in my peanut butter!"
“Two great tastes that taste great together.”
Hail to the Purple, Hail to the White
Wildcat in spirit, Wildcat in fight
Hail Alma Mater from sea to sea
Onward forever, Hail Victory!
by MadCat on Oct 28, 2011 1:02 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
This rant was much more entertaining when TB and I were sitting in my basement drinking Fat Tire and watching a horrible Big East game on Wednesday night.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
I did the same thing last night
well, we dont have basements in houston, but whatever.
I turned on the world series, and there was no world series. had to watch pitt and u conn. yuck
personally i want WVU to come so we can beat their asses every year and get revenge.
Also i was going to ask what happened with yall in the season opener against WK? just first week jitters like OU utah state last year?
@THEREALALLENOU on twitter - "The man, the verb, the legend" OU'd
Short answer on EKU...
The coach admittedly used 15% of the playbook and without going to the stats, I believe we had five turnovers.
It was just an uninspired performance.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
And this, too
Though we really shouldn’t need to use too much of the playbook to bet EKU.
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Oct 27, 2011 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions
Or beat them.
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Oct 27, 2011 11:07 AM CDT up reply actions
There wasn't a World Series game last night?
That makes more sense. I kept thinking: “Gosh this Texas team can sing”.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Ummm...
??
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Oct 27, 2011 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions
Glee
was on instead. Terrible.
"that place (West Virginia) laid the foundation for who I am. A lot of outsiders make fun of it and say negative things about West Virginia. Fuck them" - Jerry West
by MountaineerAirman on Oct 27, 2011 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Somebody should be shot for that transgression...
At least show re-runs of the Dukes of Hazzard or something, but Glee? Really?
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
by mac attack ict on Oct 27, 2011 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
And they were playing Red Rover with the offensive line don't forget.
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
They switched up the starting O-line the week before the game
Towards the end of the game they went back to the way they had been practicing for the entire fall and summer, and lo and behold we scored ten points to take the lead and win the game.
So, that is lesson 1 on why you don’t mess with your o-line only 1 week before the start of the season.
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Oct 27, 2011 11:05 AM CDT up reply actions
EKU ...
1) some first start nervousness from the QB
2) derped-up OL starting lineup
3) 5 giveaways.
by Itchy n Scratchy on Oct 27, 2011 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions
errrrr ... wasn't HBCK's first start as QB ... first start of the year as "the guy"
whatever … he was nervous.
by Itchy n Scratchy on Oct 27, 2011 11:07 AM CDT up reply actions
1. We had 5 turnovers in that game, and i think we’ve only had 3 more the entire rest of the year.
2. They switched up the O-line right before that game, and looked horrible. We went to Finney at center and looked much better, although I’m not sure how much of it was personnel and how much was our line just assuming we could do anything we wanted that game and learning they weren’t that good.
3. Very limited playbook – which shouldn’t have really been an issue, but with our line struggling we couldn’t run the ball at all and had no offense.
I don’t recall Klein running a whole lot in that game either, although my memory could be wrong. It seems like he did more handing off to our RBs, and he’s been the best thing about our offense when it’s been working.
It was a Big East game
You’re just being repetitive when you call it horrible.
by Ahearn Alley on Oct 27, 2011 5:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Nice write up
I’ve been thinking for awhile about this whole mess…
What part of the root of this problem is the acceptance of degenerated media reports as media members I trying to figure out how to incorporate this lightning fast information stream via twitter/interwebs/etc. In a world that print journalism is either kill or be killed, you end up with beat writers feeling as though they have to adopt Bill Snyder meal plans in order that they aren’t “coming in last” all the time. Unfortunately as a result, all it takes is one person saying one thing for millions of people to believe it as fact. When someone cites an “unnamed source” how are we as a public able to certify the source’s credibility. “A source close to the situation” very well could have been a college student who worked as a janitor and cleaned athletic offices before people showed up.
I think the tragedy in all of this is a much much deeper social problem. There’s no self discipline in society anymore. It’s all a “have to have it now” can’t wait world. As a result I think the integrity of good journalism is experiencing an erosion of sorts. Now I’m also a firm believer that as time goes on, that profession will learn what the pitfalls, or maybe better described as: knowing what inherent pros and cons are of the information feed.
With that being said, I can’t agree more with you more TB on your reiteration of the point that “we have completely unsourced reports” through all of this. I see there being a huge difference between what has occurred and if say the Big 12 officials themselves publically said they were inviting WVU. The ones left to look silly through all of that is whoever broke that news. Those (conference) officials know better to release statements when all said ducks are in said row. And there’s reason why no official word ever came from the conference, so why now are we trying to place blame on the conference.
Right, wrong or indifferent I understand why perception is the Big 12 has problems through this, however I think technically their hands are washed free of this mess for the time being.
Also, although it’s completely speculation on my part, I’m not convinced we have a real Texas vs OU situation going on at the present moment. Knowing that the KY representative knows Bohren throws a huge curve ball in it. Instead I think the talking heads are trying to portray the situation as a OU-UT situation. I personally think the timeline went something more like this:
Majority of Big12 was on board with WVU move.
KY rep calls up Bohren to make sure his school had a fair share in negotiations.
Bohren, being his friend went back to the conference and said, hold on a second I think we should look into Louisville a little more before pulling the trigger as a favor, or let’s see if there’s a way we can work out getting them into the conference as well. I don’t necessarily think OU wants to put all of its time in effort into pushing one candidate over the other.
I think there would be reasonable backlash against an 11th hour call from all other conference members who left a room thinking “I thought we already had this figured out”. In which case Texas was one of those voices (I don’t believe the only voice), and some newspaper reporter saw it as an opportunity to take things out of context and play out in his writing what everyone assumes is going on.
I mean c’mon people, they have closed door meetings for a reason. Do you really think we know more than say 20% of what’s going on? And do you believe that writers even know 40% of what’s going on? By the time it gets to me as a sports fan from the board room, do you really think I know what went on in how many meetings that do and don’t get made known.
That is all.
"Nor yet in Dell?"
seriously SBNation, we need an edit button!
I see at least 2 times I should have used ?s, and a couple of straggler words in my rant…
"Nor yet in Dell?"
The end result will be...
6 year grant of rights, 12 teams. Both of which I’m ok with.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
I heard some stuff recently...
This is a very quick synopsis, simply because it is second not first hand, but in a nutshell:
- The MU meeting last week was a fist thumping screaming match. The Gov wants SEC, their boad was split with the chair for the Big XII. Attorneys all over everything now including our former Big XII chair.
- Brownback at the KU chancellors meeting commenting on the Big XII being the first to 16 teams…lots of bad MU vibe there (and Curry / Schultz were in attendance).
Some other DC stuff, but nothing concrete…in a nutshell it should be interesting moving forward (as if we didn’t know that). I did not get anything on the Notre Dame / Bringham Young combo which I thought may be on the horizon, but that doesn’t mean it isn’t in other circles.
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
Governor Jay Nixon ...
Yes, We Can … chase millions of dollars a year out of the state economy.
by Itchy n Scratchy on Oct 27, 2011 3:07 PM CDT up reply actions
That is something I really don't understand...
Doesn’t he realize that the second largest city in his state (that he depends on for re-election) stands to lose millions from this?
It’s kind of mind-boggling to me that he’s in favor of this.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
It's kind of mind-boggling he's a governor
or a man of any kind of influence whatsoever.
We must talk to the same people.
I was just jumping on here. To piggyback on mac:
- If there are 10 year rights and we go to 12 with WVU and Louie, Mizzou isn’t going anywhere.
- The way we make it to 16 is inviting BEast football schools minus USF, they’ll go to the SEC to the angst of UF. (I don’t see any of this happening, FWIW)
- Notre Young would happen is Mizzou leaves, but ND won’t make a decision this MU does. Once again, we could all be screwed by MU. Guh.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
by BlackCats on Oct 27, 2011 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Our BOTC Board of Curators are currently split on Notre Young vs. Brigham Dame.
We may need a poll and a really bad sportswriter to drum up support for one side or the other.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
For the record, I favor neither ...
Just sticking up for the little guy.
by Itchy n Scratchy on Oct 27, 2011 3:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Notre Young for football
and Brigham Dame for all other sports.
The time for calm and rational discourse is past, now is the time for senseless bickering -Anonymous the Younger
BOTC - Read the Adventures of the BigXII if you doubt our serious attitude towards sports.
by Anon_the_younger on Oct 27, 2011 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
As a Mizzou guy who thinks that this thread is mostly out of its mind here
I’m going to restrict my comments to noting that Brigham Dame is about twenty kinds of awesome as a name, and you guys should find a way to keep using it no matter what happens.
I will say this...
I’ll believe anything BlackCats confirms a hundred times over what any MU beat writer would ever put in print.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
That is your prerogative.
FTR, we generally don’t much like the press either, as it’s usually busy branding us as some kind of floozy and/or lightweight. What can you do.
And Brigham Dame is still just a delicious name.
See we can compromise...that's how it is done Big 12.
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
Isn't that backwards?
Since BYU would be playing football?
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
The SEC
will never take USF. They stand absolutely nothing to gain. They dominate the Florida market. If they’re going to take another Florida team, they’ll find a way to get FSU out of the ACC.
USF has very, very little to offer the SEC.
"that place (West Virginia) laid the foundation for who I am. A lot of outsiders make fun of it and say negative things about West Virginia. Fuck them" - Jerry West
by MountaineerAirman on Oct 27, 2011 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't disagree at all
I almost laughed at the person telling me this.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Agreed, but think about it...
If MU were to stay, and we grabbed Louisville and WVU, who’s left? What ACC team is willing (and able) to fork over $20 million?
There aren’t a lot of options left. USF makes the most sense.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
They'd take Florida State
and pay the Seminoles $20 million exit fee before ever inviting South Florida. Hell, they’d take East Carolina – which stretches them into NC – before USF. Honestly, think about it: the SEC turns down WVU, but then takes South Florida? What kind of sense does that make?
Yeah, they will target FSU and Clemson
If they’re turned down, they’ll just suck it up and stick with 13 before inviting South Florida.
I didn't quite finish the circle there.
ND won’t decide till MU leaves, MU won’t leave until ND decides. (This is if we only add one team)
- Also, if you want the cluster of all clusters, get 6 year rights and both WVU and Louie. MU powers will end up suing each other to either stay or go.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Seriously, we need to dump Mizzou ...
For stability reasons, of course.
by Itchy n Scratchy on Oct 27, 2011 3:19 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
MU will be bled for every dime possible - everybody is out for blood.
Remember Ken Star? He is making rounds in DC and elsewhere making sure he has a coalition to make aTm and MU (should they leave) pay every last cent….he has been a busy boy. Go Baylor go?
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
by mac attack ict on Oct 27, 2011 3:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Which is reason number three why they haven't pulled the trigger.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
^^^ Yep ^^^ attorneys everywhere now...everybody is getting a lawyer on retainer.
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
by mac attack ict on Oct 27, 2011 3:29 PM CDT up reply actions
We have our own lawyers here at the tSTc.
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
It's true.
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Just so I'm clear...
MU does not want Notre Dame. They want…
12 teams
10 year grant of rights
WVU and Louisville additions
They get those things, they’re good?
Notre Dame joins and they go?
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
If they get those things they're good.
Then Notre Young is DOA unless we go to 14 or 16.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Good till next year
When they start getting moist for some other conference again. Too bad they will be locked in at that point but that won’t stop them from making some stupid comment about wanting something else! They need to impeach their governor. He really just needs to STFU.
Why won't ND come if Mizzou stays
I don’t even think we’re talking about football are we? Who cares about ND if they’re not bringing football….so maybe they decide to years down the road. not good and it hasn’t helped the big least..
We aren't going to take a thirteenth team in basketball and other non-revenues.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
Well, if Louisville and WVU are added, and MU stays...
That’s 12 teams. ND would make 13 in everything other than football, and therefore, we’d have a logistical problem on our hands.
You would need another non-football playing member. Therefore you start looking at the Marquettes of the world, and then you invite a whole new set of problems.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
I got to go back to my above post...
Isn’t Mizzou the better choice than ND in everything but football? If that would stabilize us for 10 years, what’s the hold up??? Bring in Louis and wvu.
I say ND
But I mean Notre Young. No one really wants BYU other than football and really, its only because the B12 can’t get ND to come in with everything.
If MU doesn’t leave then we’re at 12 and there is no need to bring Notre Young in.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
ND hasn't worked out well for the Big East
by being in everything but Football. Not sure why we would prefer that to Mizzou.
by Angus0199 on Oct 27, 2011 7:10 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Well first of all, because if/when the B12 collapses
We’re better positioned. It sounds cold and heartless but I want Mizzou locked up in the SEC.
Reason number two, I want the BEast to collapse. The four super conferences should B1G, SEC, PAC, and the B12. I haven’t figured out how to kill the ACC yet, but I haven’t put much thought into it yet. One (ok thirty) thing(s) at a time.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
How to kill the ACC = send Texas there.
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 27, 2011 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Or, better yet, kill the ACC by having them wait for Missouri to make up it's mind.
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
BUTLER.
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We would have 12 and a half in football.
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
They would bring half football as I understand it.
Meaning 6 of their games would be against the Big 12 and the rest traditional rivalries (i.e. USC, BC etc.).
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
ND is not coming - get that out of your heads
In three weeks, the Big XII will be this:
EAST DIVISION
WVU
Louisville
Kansas
Kansas State
Iowas State
Cincinnati
WEST DIVISION
Texas
OU
Texas Tech
TCU
Baylor
Okie Lite
NON-FOOTBALL MEMBERS
Notre Dame
Brigham Dame
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
by Snide Aside on Oct 27, 2011 11:01 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think anyone thinks ND is coming as a full member, only non football w/ BYU as the football member.
If we bring in Cincy, Brigham Dame would not come in at all. No need. No added value.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
by BlackCats on Oct 27, 2011 11:11 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Good point - cancel BYU and think of a replacement, I am clueless on this.
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
by Snide Aside on Oct 27, 2011 11:20 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'm not sure you know what Brigham Dame is...
Someone want to tell the new kid what the hell is going on?
Brigham Dame (or Notre Young) is our scenario in which BYU plays football in the B12 and ND plays everything else thereby making up our 12th member. If we bring in Cincy (which I’m not sure will happen, but wouldn’t hate) then there is no reason to to bring in BYU and ND to be our “twelfth” member.
Now re-read the above. It will make a whole lot more sense.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Oh, and I don't see Cincy coming because of their football program
Especially their stadium.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
There is another scenario that could make sense as well
Just take WVU and Louie and become an 11 team football conference. Bring ND in for the other sports and wait on ND to finally join in football (which they will be forced to do eventually).
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
by Snide Aside on Oct 27, 2011 11:39 PM CDT up reply actions
No
If they ever join a conference it will be the B1G. The faster we accept that, the happier our lives will be.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
by BlackCats on Oct 28, 2011 12:00 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
This... isn't true at all.
You have no idea the extent to which ND actually despises every school in the Big 10 with the exception of Michigan State. Back when Rockne was building the program, the Big 10 boycotted them. It almost killed their program. That’s why ND was forced to play a significant series with Nebraska. It’s what led to the START of the ND/USC rivalry.
Michigan State (which wasn’t in the Big 10 yet anyway) refused to play along with the midwest boycott, which is why even though they’re rivals, there’s no actual ill will.
Their reasons for not joining the Big 10 earlier pretty much all stem from this. The “we prefer to be independent” thing isn’t untrue either, but you ask the average hardcore ND fan and they’d rather join the ACC or the Big 12 before the Big 10. Not even kidding.
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I did not know that.
Was it the Catholic thing?
It still amazes me how much hatred there used to be for Catholics.
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Oct 28, 2011 10:22 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
It was an Irish thing.
100 years ago, people talked about Irish immigrants like people talk about Mexican immigrants today. They (should really say “My Peeps”) were coming over by the boatload, and were causing infrastructure problems for cities on the East Coast (this was 1850-1870s). There was a lot of hatred spewed because taxes were being raised so the cities could keep pace. That was the beginning. Then it turned into the Irish were agents of the Pope that wouldn’t pledge allegiance to the US and were trying to take over the government by controlling the police forces(1890-1960s). Prohibition didn’t help and then one of the biggest rum whiskey running Irishmen’s grandson ran for President it validated all the crazies over several generations. The Catholic hatred has gone away, but now we call it Ginger Bashing and think it’s OK without knowing why or where the root of it came from.
/fuckyouIamAredheadedstepchild
//notreally
///okmaybe
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
It was a Catholic thing, too.
Everyone thinks of the Klan as a southern deal, but they were pretty big in B10 country during that time. Especially Indiana.
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I don't bash "gingers"
Because my mom is one and I married one.
Go Irish!
/notNotreDamethough
Also, I knew that people used to hate the Irish, but I always think Catholic first when I think of Notre Dame, despite their name being the “Fighting Irish”. Weird. As Sir Jon states above, it was probably both, though I have no direct knowledge of the situation.
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Oct 28, 2011 12:23 PM CDT up reply actions
I hate to argue with Jon of Morse
And I’m going to start with a “We’ll agree to disagree”.
While you’re right about the boycott, you didn’t grow up in my household. My dad has been an Irish Legend since I was about 13 or so, and my Aunt is on the Board of Trustees. My dad and I didn’t speak more than “hi” for four years because I went to U of M Law (Law school is three years). He’s where I first heard ND had been approached by the B12 to come in with Ark, and then with Pitt and WVU. The talk about the ACC is because there is something between ND and Pitt (that I never really dug into with him) and he and my Aunt are personally lobbying for ND to come to the B12, but only because we want to have our own little hate week. When it comes down to it, if/when the TV money runs dry ND will go to a conference and the current admin would go to the B1G.
There might be some gnashing of teeth from some fans, but without a major shift of Fellows, Ford, Notebaert, Hernandez and Goodyear want it. They will get the Fellows to approve it, and if the Fellows support it the Trustees will make it so.
But you could be right. And no that’s not sarcasm.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
It just seems to me
that the “oh no we must stay independent even though it costs us money” thing is essentially fanbase-driven, is it not? Otherwise, I have to think they’d already be somewhere.
And of all schools, Notre Dame is probably more beholden to the desires of their fanbase than any other, correct?
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Well...
The only reason ND “loses” money is because they give a huge chunk to the Academic side. They’re doing just fine.
And that’s a quickly shrinking fanbase.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
No, no, by "costs us money"
I mean they’d make more in a conference than they do as independents.
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Well there maybe something to that
But they gave like $20MM to academics last year. I guess my question is, do you have to share licensing revenue if you’re in a conference? Because I think they could probably make more if they came into the B12 and got to keep their Network/NBC deal, but it might be break even since it seems a lot of their loot comes from merch.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
No, you do not have to share merch revenue.
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ND will always have the spiritual and financial support of Catholics
My daughter married an aggie Catholic. Before you say anything, he was an aggie that HATED the idea of going to the SEC (he is a smart aggie too – he knows where his wife’s inheritance lies).
My being that, although he bleeds maroon, you would think he graduated from ND – his second most favorite school.
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
by Snide Aside on Oct 28, 2011 10:33 PM CDT up reply actions
*my POINT being....
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
by Snide Aside on Oct 28, 2011 10:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Exactly
My dad grew up Catholic, married a Baptist and I grew up in an nondenomination church. One day*, my dad decided he wasn’t going to tithe to our church anymore and and started tithing to ND. About six months later became a Irish Legend.
*Our church is what people call a mega church, 10,000+ every Sunday. He figured they didn’t need his money, but ND did because they lost a couple of games that year. Kept doing it because of the football tickets, and it hacks off my mom but not enough that she won’t go to the games. Parents.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
No.
Get the 12 first. If they want in later go to 14. Can’t you boys ever be proactive down in Austin?
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
by Catbacker98 on Oct 28, 2011 12:10 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Is not my model 12 teams?
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
No
Just take WVU and Louie and become an 11 team football conference. Bring ND in for the other sports and wait on ND to finally join in football (which they will be forced to do eventually).
We need 12 solid in football for 2 divisions and a championship game. Not 11 and a we will play 3 times this year bunch.
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
Noted - I can only read my own crap just once - sorry.
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
Brigham Dame could come later either in all sports.
Or a combo with an addition of another school to get to 14. You know like those supposed “stable” conferences the ACC and SEC.
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
by Catbacker98 on Oct 28, 2011 10:05 AM CDT up reply actions
Better write up than mine, but yes there are a lot of wheels in motion now...
My other feeling is that nobody is rushing to make decisions now…things are being thought out and argued. In my experience knee jerk reactions are generally poor, so this bodes well.
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
by mac attack ict on Oct 27, 2011 3:26 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Also...
If it’s really that simple, and MU would stay if we added Louisville and WVU, why are we not granting ten years?
I mean, yeah, I get why six makes sense, and it’s more than enough, but why the hesitation?
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It Mizzou.
Common sense is not their strong suit.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
No, I mean why are we hesitating at not granting rights for ten years?
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
because Texas wants to leave after the new media deals in year 5,
and after the signing over of tier 1 and tier 2 rights expire in year 6.
It is an evil conspiracy by Texas to destablize the conference in the future after MU has left.
The time for calm and rational discourse is past, now is the time for senseless bickering -Anonymous the Younger
BOTC - Read the Adventures of the BigXII if you doubt our serious attitude towards sports.
by Anon_the_younger on Oct 27, 2011 4:42 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm not sure it bodes well
w/the ebarrasement to wvu yesterday. I think this needs to get fixed now.
Why don’t we go to 12 teams, 10 year rights and keep Mizzou and WVU and Louis. We can add a team when it gets right. I would rather have Mizzou (don’t kick me off the board) w/the tradition and location. If we think UT is a premadona, I’ll be ND is worse. And they may always want to be ind.
by Angus0199 on Oct 27, 2011 4:06 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Another viewpoint
From Berry Trammel’s blog:
"After this nonsense, it’s clearer than ever that the only the desperate would be interested in the Big 12. After this nonsense, it’s clearer than ever that getting anyone to trust this leadership, be it interim commish Chuck Neinas or defacto commish DeLoss Dodds or any school president, is fruitless. After this nonsense, it’s clearer than ever that it’s a waste of time trying to talk Missouri into staying."
…
"But to embarrass the Mountaineers like this is unforgivable. I have no idea who to blame. I think Neinas is the least likely suspect. This kind of madness was going on before he arrived and this kind of madness was going on after Beebe was beheaded. So the common denominators are the leaders at the schools."
http://blog.newsok.com/berrytramel/2011/10/26/big-12-football-more-madness-in-conference-realignment/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
This crap between Boren and Deloss needs to stop.
oh hail the Purple and White
by Furnace76 on Oct 27, 2011 6:30 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
eh, still seems like a weakly based assumption from my perspective
Berry hasn’t necessarily been able to keep his cool amongst his reporting either.
I don’t remember Neinas coming out and releasing the we have extended WVU an invite press release.
"Nor yet in Dell?"
I think the primary leaks came first from Chip Brown, Bevo's lackey
But why are their leaks to begin with? These folks are amateurs compared to Delaney, Slive and Scott. Trammel’s broader point that the “common denominators are the leaders of the schools” seems pretty valid to me.
oh hail the Purple and White
by Furnace76 on Oct 27, 2011 8:27 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I do agree that a lot of these school president's seem like idiots.
Makes me appreciate Schultz all the more.
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Oct 27, 2011 8:53 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I am impressed by the way Shulz and Currie have kept their cards close to the vest
oh hail the Purple and White
Not hard to do when you're holding 2/9 offsuit
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
by TB on Oct 27, 2011 9:53 PM CDT up reply actions
True
I still like to think that even with a royal flush we wouldn’t be running around making comments to the press left and right like Loftin and Boren have been.
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Oct 28, 2011 9:10 AM CDT up reply actions
This is what happens when you allow professors to make business decisions - that is why they are professors!
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
I feel really uncomfortable that a Texan has agreed with me.
It makes me question everything I believe in…
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Oct 28, 2011 9:32 AM CDT up reply actions
LOL - you may live to regret that remark
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
The school leaders are lousing this up, big time.
I don’t understand why it is so hard to sit down, figure out we need 12 teams and then STICK WITH THE ONE YOU CHOOSE! Why is this hard?
Haggle over money later. You make a decision, then stick to it. So embarrassing. It’s no wonder this conference is viewed like a bastard child by the rest of the world. Look at what they are doing…
Mr. Trammel should just shut his pie hole.
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
Or maybe folks should quit leaking crap to Chip Brown?
oh hail the Purple and White
To be honest their both just stinking terrible...
Chip Brown just has national attention these days and Tramel doesn’t.
Bobby Hill: What's a meat examination team?
Hank Hill: It's like a debate team, only instead of doing something useless you get to grade the cut and quality of meat!
Truth.
Berry Tramel is, to put it bluntly, a freakin’ idiot hack whose job is to stir up crap. He does no actual reporting. He takes what he’s fed, and then regurgitates something to generate controversy.
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Oh for fuck's sake.
UVA? SMH.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
If this is a fake, it's good work.
If it’s not a fake, we’re going to sue the pants off of everyone.
Tiger Tracks: Missouri Joins The SEC
Updated 10/22/2011
3 0 27 6
By: Sean Cartell
SEC Digital Network
COMPLETE MISSOURI COVERAGE AT THE SEC DIGITAL NETWORK
University Of Missouri: What You Need To Know
Missouri-SEC Connections: A History
Homecoming Tradition Traced To Missouri
Missouri To The SEC: The Dortch Report (Basketball)
Missouri To The SEC: Barnhart’s Take
BIRMINGHAM, Ala. – Given the ever-changing conference paradigm over the past year, the Southeastern Conference has continued to demonstrate its commitment to maintaining its stature as one of the nation’s premier conferences by welcoming the University of Missouri as the league’s 14th member, Commissioner Mike Slive announced Monday.
Missouri joins Texas A&M University as the league’s two new institutions who will begin full membership on July 1, 2012. It is the first expansion of the SEC membership since Arkansas and South Carolina joined the conference in 1992.
Missouri was a charter member of the Missouri Valley Intercollegiate Athletic Association in 1907, which became the Big Six Conference in 1964, the Big Eight Conference in 1964 and the Big 12 Conference in 1996.
Geographically, it is a natural fit as the state of Missouri touches more states (Arkansas, Kentucky and Tennessee) that currently are home to an SEC institution than any other state that is not in the league’s previous 13-member footprint. Like the majority of the cities in the SEC, Columbia, Mo., is a college-centered town with a metropolitan population of 164,283, making it the fifth-largest city in the state of Missouri.
With an enrollment of 32,415, the University of Missouri boasts a strong academic resume, as it is one of only five universities nationwide with law, medicine, veterinary medicine and a research reactor on one campus. Six of Missouri’s sports teams last season led the Big 12 in graduation rate for their respective sports.
Culturally, Missouri is as well known for its barbecue, country music, history and rich tradition as the majority of the current states of the SEC.
Missouri is one of only 35 public U.S. universities invited to membership in the prestigious Association of American Universities (AAU). It will become the fourth SEC school that is part of the AAU, joining Florida, Texas A&M and Vanderbilt.
*******************
Monday’s announcement marks just the fourth time in the history of the conference that the SEC will expand its membership. In a landscape that has seemed ever-changing in recent years, the SEC has exemplified stability as 10 of its original 13 members remain.
The league began as a 13-team league until Sewanee’s departure from the conference in 1940. After Georgia Tech’s move to independent status in 1964, the league had 11 members before Tulane departed in 1966, leaving the SEC as a 10-team conference for more than two decades.
At the start of the decade of the 1990s, a similar shift in conference alignment allowed Arkansas and South Carolina to join the SEC. The benefits have been nothing short of outstanding.
Soon after joining the league, the Razorbacks claimed the 1994 NCAA Championship in men’s basketball and finished as the NCAA runner-up the following year. They made their first appearance in the SEC Championship football game in 1995, appearing again in 2002 and 2006.
The Arkansas women’s basketball team made its first-ever Final Four appearance in 1998 before winning the WNIT the next season. The level of track and field in the SEC was quickly raised with the addition of the Razorbacks. Arkansas’ men won cross country national titles in 1992, 1993, 1995, 1998, 1999 and 2000. Men’s NCAA Indoor Track and Field Championships came every year from 1993-2000 and again in 2003, 2005 and 2006. The men also claimed NCAA Outdoor Track and Field Championships from 1993-1999 and again in 2003.
South Carolina won the Women’s NCAA Outdoor Track and Field Championship in 2002, becoming, at the time, just the second different SEC team to claim an NCAA Women’s Outdoor Track and Field Championship. The past two seasons have been magical ones for the Gamecocks, as they have captured back-to-back NCAA Championships in baseball and advanced to the SEC Championship game in football for the first time in the program’s history.
On September 25, 2011, Texas A&M was announced as the league’s 13th member, beginning with the 2012-13 academic year.
*******************
Missouri took to the field for the first time in 1890, making it one of the first SEC institutions to begin playing football. Kentucky played a three-game schedule in 1881, but didn’t play again until a decade later. Vanderbilt also began its football program in 1890.
Don Faurot was one of the early founders of Missouri athletics, as he was a three-sport standout for the Tigers from 1922-24. He served the school as its football coach from 1935-56 and continued on as the athletics director until 1967. Faurot is known for the creation of the Split-T formation in 1941. The formation’s option play still today serves as the basis for many present-day schemes, including the Wishbone, Wingbone, Veer and I-Formation.
Faurot compiled a record of 101-79-10, making the school’s first modern-day bowl appearance in 1939 when it advanced to the Orange Bowl. Until 1994, the year prior to his death, Faurot was heavily involved in the annual Blue-Gray football game in Montgomery, Ala.
The Tigers rose to national prominence under head coach Dan Devine in the 1960s, when Devine’s winning percentage of .767 was the best in the nation during that decade. In 13 seasons at Missouri, Devine posted a record of 93-37-7 and eight players earned First-Team All-America honors. His 1960 Missouri squad finished with an 11-0 record and defeated Navy 21-14 in the Orange Bowl. The 1965 squad went 8-2-1 and defeated Florida in the Sugar Bowl. The Tigers won the Big Eight Conference in 1960 and 1969 under Devine.
Since 2007, the football Tigers have claimed three Big 12 North Championships. Under current head coach Gary Pinkel, Missouri posted a 12-2 record in 2007 and defeated Arkansas in the Cotton Bowl.
The Tigers began playing basketball in 1906 and enjoyed the greatest amount of success under legendary head coach Norm Stewart from 1967-99. In 32 years, Stewart led Missouri to 634 wins and 333 losses for a .656 winning percentage, the best in program history. Stewart’s teams won 20 or more games 17 times, including a school-record 29 wins during the 1988-89 season. He won eight Big Eight Conference championships and six conference tournament titles.
Missouri started competing in the sport of baseball in 1891 and won the College World Series in 1954, marking the school’s first national title in any sport. The Tigers have made six CWS appearances in the program’s history, including three national runner-up finishes (1952, 1958, 1964).
The Tigers also have had great success in the sport of track and field and won the NCAA Men’s Indoor Championship in 1965. The soccer and softball teams have been proficient as of late with soccer winning the 2009 Big 12 Championship and softball claiming that title in 2011.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
Whaaa?
Did someone fuck up and post it a week early?
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Yep. It's all out there now. Dave Matter has it in the tribune, Clay Travis has it on OKTC, and TB has a cached article he'll post in tomorrow's slate.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
Tortitos Away
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
That will help maintain "stability" in the Big 12.
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
by Catbacker98 on Oct 28, 2011 12:14 AM CDT up reply actions
Evidently, when you mentioned "sue", that article was pulled from the posting.
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
I'm sure that folks in the Big 12 office have copies. If not, some savvy Internet users have them downloaded.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
The Internet never goes away.
Web.archive.Org
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
I get that you are coming from a place of anger
But the chances of the Big XII suing the SEC are smaller than Missouri making a run to a BCS bowl this year. The Big XII has been inviting other conference teams left and right — including from a conference that is actually on the brink of dying.
by MU'97 on Oct 27, 2011 11:26 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Want to make a bet on that?
Missouri, if they want to go to the SEC in 2012, will pay a minimum of $15 million in an exit fee, and that’s a very, very low estimate.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
The apple is now an orange?
Exit fees are not lawsuits. You were talking about suing the pants off people.
I think we will pay an exit fee, of course. I don’t know if $15 million is “very, very low” - but it could be higher. I don’t think it’s going to be in the $30$40MM range, though.
by MU'97 on Oct 27, 2011 11:41 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'm aware of that. I'm trying to type it all out while watching the World Series, so my thoughts are fragmented.
Missouri’s exit fee, should the leave, is going to be high. That was our only impediment to you leaving. However, the threat of true legal action, especially if it’s found that they had an informal agreement before they officially withdrew from the conference, may be a game changer.
This is why A&M performed that very, very planned and intricate dance, and it’s why you were following right in their footsteps. This is kind of a big deal. It proves the SEC already considered you signed, sealed, and delivered before you ever submitted your withdrawl.
That’s torturous interference, and it’s exactly what the SEC doesn’t want to happen because it voids contracts and opens them up to big money lawsuits from the Big 12.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
Tortious*
Hail to the Purple, Hail to the White
Wildcat in spirit, Wildcat in fight
Hail Alma Mater from sea to sea
Onward forever, Hail Victory!
Right click spell check error on my part.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
It's a little torturous too.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Tortitos
Danny was right all along?
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
by Catbacker98 on Oct 28, 2011 12:16 AM CDT up reply actions
Tortitos Interference is a grave offense.
Hail to the Purple, Hail to the White
Wildcat in spirit, Wildcat in fight
Hail Alma Mater from sea to sea
Onward forever, Hail Victory!
Did you know that Danny has a mustache now?
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
by Catbacker98 on Oct 28, 2011 12:25 AM CDT up reply actions
Beebestache
Hail to the Purple, Hail to the White
Wildcat in spirit, Wildcat in fight
Hail Alma Mater from sea to sea
Onward forever, Hail Victory!
I still Belibee!
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
by BlackCats on Oct 28, 2011 1:00 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
But the Big XII is going the same thing to the Big East!
The defense of unclean hands will apply here. And for the Big XII to sue the SEC, it will have to demonstrate that it is worth less w/o Missouri. Given that some have already gone on record about the conference is moving on (and that W. Va. is better), the only way for that to happen is for the TV deals to get cut. And I think the Big XII will manage to keep their TV dollars.
Not if we don't have ten teams in 2012.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
But between 2 and 5 teams are fighting to get in!!!
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 12:06 AM CDT up reply actions
Depends on whether or not Maranetto (sp?) will let them leave before 2013.
Therein lies the issue.
If the Big East keeps those teams one more year, their contracts stay intact, and we don’t get sued.
However, if Missouri leaves in 2012 and we don’t have a replacement team for #10, we’re in danger with the Fox contract (who demand a minimum of ten teams), thereby opening up legal action against Missouri and the SEC.
I know that this violates the Unholy Alliance and all, but it’s strictly business, dudes.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
Did aTm or MU take it below 10? Or UNL or CU?
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 12:12 AM CDT up reply actions
MU
Should have been quicker. Your the one with blood on your hands now.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Hand in the cookie jar?
You knew what I meant.
/dramaqueen
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Is that a legal term?
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 12:15 AM CDT up reply actions
No, but it's clear neither of you know much about legal terminology
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
State you reasoning. How do you know I haven't been bar certified longer than you?
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 12:16 AM CDT up reply actions
Maybe you have, and I accidentally lumped you in with '97
’97 is up there talking about unclean hands in a situation where that doctrine has no application whatsoever.
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
Fair enough:
Equitable defense to equitable remedies. 1 a.m. lawyering strieks again. But it sure as hell would be relevant.
I think B12 conference actions are all relevant in any negotiaion vis a vis exit fees.
Do you not?
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 12:24 AM CDT up reply actions
No. Not at all.
Exit fees is a misnomer. It should properly be called liquidated damages. It’s supposed to be an estimate of how much harm the conference would suffer in the event a school leaves. The only thing that’s really relevant in that situation is the state of the conference after the school leaves. Whether the conference went out and poached other schools is irrelevant to that situation, except to establish that the conference is either in better shape, about the same, or worse shape than before.
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
While I agree in principle, if one were to litigate, the actions of the conference become relevant.
Thus a reason for the conference to settle for less than actual damages. “Let’s make this quick, tidy, and quiet.” These are always considerations in avoiding litigation, no?
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 12:35 AM CDT up reply actions
Why settle when you can just stay at nine and sue the SEC for a few hundred million?
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
That's why I brought the laywer in here.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
this is NOT how the B12 handled CU or UNL.
Their history shows a desire to make it “go away” for a reasonable amount. Do you believe this will change, especially after Texas, OU, OSU, TTech all tried to leave to the PAC this year?
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 12:51 AM CDT up reply actions
But they didn't leave.
And I think we’re going to be aggressive in liquidated damages (see TB!) negotiations due to the value of the Fox contract negotiated after NU and CU left.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
As Texas and OU seem to drive this train, are you speaking for them?
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 1:00 AM CDT up reply actions
Oh for the love of God, it's a prediction, damn it.
Hence the use of the word ‘think’.
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I'm sorry, but if the fans of KSU can speak for UT and OU, they would have long ago.
While we are in the same conference today, the goals of each school are varied, as we have seen.
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 1:04 AM CDT up reply actions
Absolutely
I’m just saying that “you can add schools that replace our value” is a much better argument than “well, you did what the SEC did.”
Again, I don’t think whether the Big 12 has unclean hands has any relevance whatsoever to the liquidated damages negotiation. It may have some relevance to a possible tortious interference claim against the SEC, but even that is questionable.
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
Thanks TB. I didn't want to have to whip out my card.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
A&M left first and TCU made ten. The next school to leave through the turnstyle is in the crosshairs.
Right now, the threat of legal action against the SEC in terms of A&M is most likely dead because we found a replacement that can play in 2010.
Due to how late in the game this is, and how close we’re getting to the deadline, this could become a problem for them.
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Unholy Alliance is dead to me.
Get them the fuck out.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
West Virginia and Louisville have already openly applied to the Big 12.
Missouri has not openly applied to the SEC.
There is a difference here, a legal one, that is very, very relevant.
The Wiki (I Don't Have a Real Name Yet) -- The Blog (Those Other Guys) -- The Twitter
Contributor at Bring on the Cats, SBNation's Kansas State blog
EDSBS Censor Librorum Promulgatio Media
Texas would never hire you as their lawyer.
Keep this quote.
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 12:02 AM CDT up reply actions
That's good because I'm not a lawyer.
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Somebody find TB and wake his ass up.
I’m too drunk for this shit.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
He's awake. We're chatting.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
Then maybe you shouldn't be interpreting the law:
However, the threat of true legal action, especially if it’s found that they had an informal agreement before they officially withdrew from the conference, may be a game changer.
This is why A&M performed that very, very planned and intricate dance, and it’s why you were following right in their footsteps. This is kind of a big deal. It proves the SEC already considered you signed, sealed, and delivered before you ever submitted your withdrawl.
That’s torturous interference, and it’s exactly what the SEC doesn’t want to happen because it voids contracts and opens them up to big money lawsuits from the Big 12.
Unless your goal is to spread inaccuracies.
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 12:09 AM CDT up reply actions
It's all over Twitter, dude. I'm not the first to make an inference whatsoever.
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I have paged the lawyer. Please hold.
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Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
Whaddayawant!!??!!
;o)
Hail to the Purple, Hail to the White
Wildcat in spirit, Wildcat in fight
Hail Alma Mater from sea to sea
Onward forever, Hail Victory!
twitter = law for sure
TB = Ken Starr for sure.
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 12:14 AM CDT up reply actions
The extra "r" makes him special.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
MrdrCat
Oh my. It does work!
Hail to the Purple, Hail to the White
Wildcat in spirit, Wildcat in fight
Hail Alma Mater from sea to sea
Onward forever, Hail Victory!
Parrrrdon me, I was channeling my innerrrr Mike Leach.
(via typos)
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 12:26 AM CDT up reply actions
No sir I will not go to the tractor shed.
/gonnatellmydaddy
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
by Catbacker98 on Oct 28, 2011 12:27 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Saw highlights with James jr catching TD pass in win over OU.
Why would the pirate waste such a talent?
Mistaken for a mushroom? Was it revenge for the alleged dead hookers? (Pirates love hookers, no?)
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 12:32 AM CDT up reply actions
It's, like, more Star.
Hail to the Purple, Hail to the White
Wildcat in spirit, Wildcat in fight
Hail Alma Mater from sea to sea
Onward forever, Hail Victory!
Look, does this leak guarantee a lawsuit?
No, it doesn’t. It’s entirely possible that Missouri leaves, the Big 12 adds some number of teams and decides there’s no reason to pursue a tortious interference claim against anyone because no TV contracts were lost.
On the other hand, if Missouri keeps dithering around, and the Big East solidifies in the mean time, and then Missouri leaves with no viable expansion candidates and the Big 12 is stuck with nine schools…well, that’s a different story.
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
reasonable statement, agreed.
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 12:19 AM CDT up reply actions
Two thoughts.
1. I do not think “we” are dithering. I think we are negotiating the exit fee. We are gone and everybody knew it before the press release hit the Internet.
2. It is hard to imagine the Big East stabalizing in any meaningful way that would prefent the Big 12 from taking W. Va., Louisville or CInci (not to mention BYU). ECU and Army are not going to keep those teams there.
But what if they threw in Boise State?
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Just kidding.
Hail to the Purple, Hail to the White
Wildcat in spirit, Wildcat in fight
Hail Alma Mater from sea to sea
Onward forever, Hail Victory!
So you were leaving all along and not just "exploring options"?
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather in a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi
by Catbacker98 on Oct 28, 2011 12:26 AM CDT up reply actions
Let's try here.
Winning!
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
I put T B Attorney into GIS
Tadaaaa!
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Panjandrum - I like the cut of your jib.
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
I think we all learned something today...
1) I’m not a lawyer
2) It’s always good to have one you can pull out of your back pocket
3) Which is handy because this place is freaking crawling with lawyers
4) I want the Big 12 to sue the ever loving shit out of someone for this mess
Bring on the Cats - Our Site
@PJ_BOTC - My Twitter
Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
you do realize the chance of actual litigation over B12 conference realignment is extremely small, don't you?
Emotion vs legal reality. Do you think MU has been dallying for weeks for publicity or in order to satisfy certain LEGAL issues?
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 12:56 AM CDT up reply actions
Yes, I'm aware it's small. Yes, I realize that the road to that lawsuit and this SEC faux paus may not have a role to play in it...
However, I will be completely honest and open about the fact that I hope the Big 12 squeezes every nickle and dime we can get out of anyone that leaves this conference. No matter how much I may have liked them in the past. Part of it out of our economic interests and the other part out of spite.
Bring on the Cats - Our Site
@PJ_BOTC - My Twitter
Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
by Panjandrum on Oct 28, 2011 1:05 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I understand the hate. Just wanted to see if you saw the logic behind the actions. It is now clear to me that you do.
I will not troll you further.
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 1:12 AM CDT up reply actions
And that is also exactly how I felt when CU and UNL were leaving.
But legal realities led to a different result, which I understand and expect for aTm and MU.
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 1:39 AM CDT up reply actions
You do realize 95% of what is said on this board is laced with sarcasm.
The other 15% could make you look like a mental midget in about two seconds.
And I’ll take legal issues for $15MM Alex.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
BECAUSE WE GIVE 110%!!!
Bring on the Cats - Our Site
@PJ_BOTC - My Twitter
Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -- Mark Twain
by Panjandrum on Oct 28, 2011 1:08 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
This is why you are 7-0. No one gives a higher percent than KSU.
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 1:13 AM CDT up reply actions
Damn it! You ruin all my fun.
I had it set and everything.
And yes the only reason I insulted you was to piss you off enough to say: “hey dumbass that’s 110%”. I’m sure you’re very nice and your mother loves you.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
You already settled it with us on the field this year.
to be determined if 2012 has us playing again, or if it has been settled permanently. Personally, I’m thinking Snyder got the LAST laugh. Just as I remember as a kid.
Best wishes for a strong KSU finish this year. Take it to the house.
#TakeTheCannonOnTheRoad to Arrowhead
Blow Lowrentz to heck
by Spider_Monkey on Oct 28, 2011 1:29 AM CDT up reply actions
I said you were missed earlier
Now I hate the fact that you wish for a strong KSU finish. Don’t wish nice things upon us! Because I hate you!
/jk
//notreally
Bobby Hill: What's a meat examination team?
Hank Hill: It's like a debate team, only instead of doing something useless you get to grade the cut and quality of meat!
Get a room you two.
Thanks Spider.
/beatKU
/RollTire
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
Oh Spider, you know we love you.
Would you like some Freys with that?
by ChrisP Wildcat on Oct 28, 2011 9:23 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Wow. What we learned yesterday:
- With all the issuses across the border, Mizzou was doing a good job of keeping their apparently already made decisions a secret.
- Now that we know they’re gone the battle will rage.
- First, 10 or 12?
If 10, who?
If 12, take WVU and Louie. Who’s the 12th? Give Brigham Dame till Christmas, then pick someone else not named Air Force.
When life hands you lemons, make grape juice. Let them wonder how the F*ck you did it.
SEC is getting irritated by this
They are clearly telling MU to shit or get off the pot with this release. I’m doubting it was really an accident.
WHarry
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
Wasn't Harry Truman born there? That explains a lot.
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
The second post was a ricochet - sorry.
We’re Texas.
We don’t derive our value or self-definition from conference affiliation.
If that strikes people as cocky, so what? It’s also true. None of us will chant our conference’s name when we have an off year and Texas Tech wins their bowl game. Our definition of self comes from us – not our conference, not our rivals, not media perception.
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