Despite the South's Domination, It Is Not Yet Time to Shake Up the Big 12
Much of the offseason talk in the Big 12 has focused on structural changes to the conference. We've engage in some of that here at BOTC, discussing who the conference should consider adding were one of the members to skip town, not to mention whether the divisions should be realigned, and how it could be done.
Over at his blog on the Tulsa World, Dave Sittler has discussed the subject, too. His focus was the increasing imbalance of power between the North and the South. In short, Sittler proposes we junk the current divisional system so that the two best teams can meet in the conference title game each year. Specifically, he wants the two best teams, as determined by Texas' favorite benchmark, the BCS, to meet at Jerry World in Dallas to settle the score.
First of all, Sittler doesn't address how conference play will be handled if the divisions are dropped. I assume he isn't proposing an 11-game round-robin, which would be interesting, but severely detrimental to the conference's chances of ever having a representative in the BCS National Title Game. But that's not the really important point, because even I could probably find an acceptable way to set up the schedule. Hell, they should just ask The Boy over at Rock M Nation. I'm sure he would have some suggestions.
Anyway, the important point is not how conference play would be handled in such a scenario. To me, the real question is whether we really need to drop the divisional alignments at all. Sittler and other Confederates (pro-South, not pro-slavery, in this case) would argue that it's just not fair to the second-best team in the South to watch some whipping-boy Yankee get thrown to the wolves each December.
Even I, the consummate North apologist, cannot deny that the South is absolutely kicking the North's ass right now. The numbers don't lie. But, as I've noticed in many areas of life - politics, science, music etc. - people only seem to remember the recent past, and forget the more distant past a little too easily.
I may not have remembered it because I was just a kid at the time, but were the columnists for the Kansas City Star and Omaha World-Herald proclaiming back in 1999 that we needed to do away with the conference's divisions so the two best teams, in this case those from the North, could settle the score in the conference title game? Because they would have had a case, based on Sittler's logic.
Sittler laments the inequity in a system that permits 9-3 (5-3) Missouri to meet up with 11-1 (7-1) Oklahoma in the conference title game, while Texas (11-1, 7-1) and Texas Tech (11-1, 7-1) sit at home. But where was Sittler in 1996, when 10-2 (7-1) Colorado was stuck at home while Nebraska played 8-5 (6-2) Texas? Yes, I realize Texas won, but even the most ardent Cow Worshippers couldn't have expected a win.
Or how about in 1997, when 11-1 (7-1) K-State was stuck at home while Nebraska played 9-4 (6-2) Texas A&M, and slaughtered the defenseless Aggies? Or maybe 1999, when K-State was again left home with an 11-1 (7-1) record while Nebraska took on 9-5 (6-2) Texas, a team K-State had defeated 35-17 in Austin?
Maybe 2001 isn't the best example, because the South challenger was 11-2 Texas, but Nebraska was left out of the conference title game that year despite an 11-2 record. Of course, they were gifted the national title game as a consolation, although I'm guessing it was cold comfort after Hurricane Future NFL Stars blitzed them in Pasadena.
Anyway, it's not like we haven't seen this before. We've seen arguably the second-best team in the conference get shut out of the title game because the single best team in the conference was in their division before, and we've seen it on the North side of the ledger.
What's the point? The point is, let's be cautious before we go making drastic changes to the conference structure based on the South's current domination. I'm not yet convinced this isn't essentially a cyclical changing of the guard. Think back to when the Big 12 was formed. Oklahoma went 3-8, 4-8, and 5-6 in its first three Big 12 seasons. Texas threw in a nice little 4-7 season in 1997, along with a bunch of pedestrian eight- and nine-win seasons. Texas also couldn't beat K-State to...oh wait, that's still true. Texas Tech was a South Plains afterthought, never winning more than six games until 2002. Texas A&M enjoyed as much success as anyone in the early years of the Big 12, but even the Aggies were capable of a couple 6-6 seasons. Oklahoma State was 34-45 from 1996-2001. Baylor was the Baylor we've all come to know so well.
In my opinion, the line of demarcation for when things really started to swing toward the South was 2002. Nebraska had pretty much run out of magic by then (don't tell their fans that), K-State was in the final two years of Bill Snyder's glory, and Colorado competed in its last conference title game. Meanwhile, Oklahoma had won a national title, Texas was becoming a consistent 10+ game winner, and Mike Leach was starting to do a little better than .500 each season. Sure, there was the K-State "upset" of Oklahoma in 2003, but since 2002 the South has utterly dominated the conference title game, winning five to the North's one. From 2002 back to the conference's formation, the South led, 4-3, in conference titles, but two of them were won in the most shocking fashion. In the first, Texas beat Nebraska on one of the most insane playcalls I've ever seen. In the second, Texas A&M stood around and ate some St. Louis BBQ and let K-State self-destruct in the most spectacular fashion ever seen. If ifs and buts were candy and nuts we'd all have a merry Christmas, but in those formative years, the North was an eyelash from owning five titles to the South's two.
Here's what I'm getting at. After next season, a season in which the South will surely dominate again, we will have finished the Big 12's second seven-year stint. If we don't start seeing the North teams challenge more consistently in the next two or three years, then I will be more open to calls for restructuring the conference. Until then, however, I'm willing to wait and see if Gary Pinkel can continue Mizzou's success and pull them to higher accomplishments. I'll wait to see if Bo Pelini continues the improvement he showed at Nebraska last season. I'll (gulp) keep an eye on KU and see if they're anything more than a flash in the pan, accomplished with smoke and mirrors. I'll see if Colorado can avoid injuries on the offensive line this season and thereby establish a running game and protect their quarterback. I'll see if Bill Snyder can work another Miracle in Manhattan. I'll...well, I won't hold my breath on Iowa State.
Meanwhile, that's only one part of the equation. As we saw with Oklahoma and Texas in the conference's early years, even the traditional powers are only one bad coaching hire away from mediocrity. Bob Stoops isn't going to coach forever. Mack Brown is stepping down soon at UT. Maybe Will Muschamp will be a badass replacement who will keep things going where the CEO left off. Or maybe he'll turn out to be a guy who should be a lifetime coordinator, ala Gene Chizik or Ron Prince. Mike Leach probably isn't going to stay at Texas Tech forever, and who is going to replace the mad pirate in Lubbock if/when he leaves? Mike Sherman strikes me as a Bill Callahan clone in College Station, and I'm not changing that opinion until the results show otherwise.
The current state of the conference in football is a definite cause for concern for those teams in the Sunflower, Show-Me, Centennial, Cornhusker and Hawkeye states. But forgive me if I hold off on advocating large-scale restructuring of the conference for just a little bit longer.
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"Mack Brown is stepping down soon at UT."
I wouldn’t be so sure about that, depending on what you mean by “soon.”
I don’t remember 1997-2000 particularly well because that was before I attended college, but I think what has made last season and likely next season so bad for the South has been that it’s not just the top two teams in the South that are better. It starts getting absurd when the third or fourth best team in one division is better than any team in the other division.
Fair points
We don’t know how long Brown is going to keep coaching at UT. But since they’ve already named his successor, and given him a salary that borders on the absurd, my guess is it won’t be long.
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
But it's not like Texas cannot afford to pay a coordinator 900k for several years
I think the deal was more about keeping Muschamp as the coordinator than about naming a successor to Brown. It accomplishes both, but I wouldn’t be surprised if Muschamp is never the head coach at Texas.
by Texas Wahoo on Apr 28, 2009 12:01 PM CDT up reply actions
I think we agree...
… that the kneejerk reactionary responses to every problem accomplishes nothing. You and I were on the same boat about the mini-panic that took the world by storm with the Big 12 tiebreaker.
Originally, I’d wanted to write a flowing, eloquent treatise that argued that Big 12 supremacy is cyclical, but I’m really starting to think that’s not the case. I think this conference changed for good once the financial giants in Austin and Norman finally woke up (and God knows what could happen if Tech can ever come up with a lot of money or Texas A&M and Oklahoma State’s teams can ever be as productive as their fundraising departments). The result is a competitive imbalance that the divisional system has helped alleviate. I don’t want to sound like a dirty North socialist by saying, “We can’t compete so please just leave it alone so we can have our shot,” but in a conference that won’t share revenue, this is the only conceivable way the playing field can be somewhat leveled, although it will never truly be even.
It has nothing to do with socialism...but I get your point...
Leagues that participate in revenue sharing grow stronger. Look at the NFL. Look at the SEC. It’s good for the conference to have strong teams, and strong teams come from TV revenue.
The Big 12 shares bowl revenue, but the TV contract is a freaking sham, and you can blame the University Presidents at Texas, A&M, and Nebraska for that pathetic contract.
The schools in question think that if they share TV money, they lose some sort of competitive advantage. Yeah, right. If we split TV money, Texas is still going to have three times the budget we have. Nebraska will still have twice the budget because of the zombies that give to the Huskers like it’s a Jerry Lewis Telethon. Being part of a conference means that you ‘share’. If you don’t, it means that you’re a selfish ass.
Basketball will continue to have parity in this league because KSU and MU are starting to come back into relevancy. However, football will always be South dominated because they get all of the players from Texas to stay at home. It has nothing to do with money. We could possibly fund another sport (like Softball) if we split TV revenue, but nooooooooooo. The Texas schools just need to keep all of that money so they can build bigger jumbotrons than the the other Texas school that just built one.
Bring on the Cats
"Without getting into specifics, my exit involves a McFlurry machine and a video tape of risque commercials from overseas." -- Jack Donaghy
I'm not sure your rant makes a lot of sense at the end
Who’s to say that the money Texas/NU/OU/A&M are keeping is going to building bigger jumbotrons and not going to helping those schools field more sports? The money is going to go somewhere and that school is going to do something with it – why would KState start a softball program while you think Texas wastes it on jumbotrons? Maybe if Texas didn’t have to share the bowl money, they could have a men’s soccer team. I guess my point is just that it seems inconsistent to assume that the schools with more money are wasting the TV revenue they get while the teams with less money would use it to fund money-losing sports.
Also, the Pac 10 shares revenues and it has the worst TV contract of all of the major conferences. And baseball doesn’t share revenues (at least not like the NFL/NBA/NHL) and MLB has higher revenues than all but the NFL, and they’re way closer to the NFL than the NBA is to them. Perhaps sharing all revenues makes conferences/leagues stronger, but citing random examples does not prove that.
by Texas Wahoo on Apr 28, 2009 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions
Doesn't Title-9 dictate the amount of sports a school can have?
But I think the point Pan was making is that the UT/NU/OU/A&M uses that money to attract recruits by having amazing facilities and ammenities like the godzillatron. With revenue sharing, maybe schools like K-State can have an easier time keeping up with the Jones’s.
I’ve said time and time again, that the problem isn’t with revenue sharing or who makes more money that who. K-State will never be able to compete in that regard with any of those schools. It just isn’t going to happen. But in effort to level the playing field (which one could argue that this may or may not be a good thing, but I’m not going to go into that right now), there needs to be a cap to what a school can/should spend on sports. All that extra money a school makes off it’s athletic department should go back into the school. Academic scholarships, improving facilities, research, etc.
Introducing the new 2008 Big 12 Football Champions: OU, UT*, TT*, and MU*!
Title 9 only dictates the number of sports a school can have...
in that school’s must have more women’s sports if they want to add a men’s sport. So it’s much more expensive to add a men’s sport because you need to add a women’s sport that will require the same number of scholarships and spending. Texas has 20 sports, whereas a school like Ohio State has around 30 (I think).
Who would set the cap on what a school could spend on sports? The Big XII can’t do it; they wouldn’t be able to compete with the other conferences if they did. The NCAA would have difficulty doing it for various reasons, not the least is the fear that some school would sue them for antitrust violations and win (like OU did back in the day about the TV restrictions). A school like Texas has a completely self-funded athletic department. The money made off of football and basketball goes to funding all of the other sports and then what is left over is given back to the university in the form of scholarships and professorships named after coaches, etc. Perhaps UT spends too much on their football program. That money is needed to keep sports like golf and women’s volleyball going. Perhaps they spend too much on their volleyball program too. But like any good business, the more money you put into it, the more money you get out of it.
by Texas Wahoo on Apr 28, 2009 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm not trying to argue against UT's logic
because obviously their athletic financial model is paying off great dividends for the university.
I think the NCAA should step in (shudder, a cold shiver just went down my back…) and help monitor this. They should be the ones dictating the budget caps, not the individual conferences.
I think I just may regret making that last statement…..
Introducing the new 2008 Big 12 Football Champions: OU, UT*, TT*, and MU*!
You won't regret it...
…because it will never happen. If the NCAA tried, schools like Texas, Ohio State, USC, Florida, etc., would create their own collegiate-sports body and tell everyone else to piss off.
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
Two things:
1) My rant was just that…a rant. It was not an argument. I do get upset about the inequality in collegiate sports, but I get upset about inequality in professional sports as well. It just promotes a lack of competitiveness, and due to that, a bad product. I’ve gone on record multiple times to admit that UT is the flagship of this conference, but I wish they’d lead by example and try to promote the distribution of wealth in the conference. A strong Big 12 helps UT just as much as it helps Kansas State.
2) I’m bitter, so don’t expect me to make sense. I’m arguing from a general sense of anger, and therefore, I don’t expect it to make sense. I hope to overcome that by being pithy.
Bring on the Cats
"Without getting into specifics, my exit involves a McFlurry machine and a video tape of risque commercials from overseas." -- Jack Donaghy
"A strong Big 12 helps UT just as much as it helps Kansas State."
I agree completely. But is anyone suggesting that the Big XII is not as strong as ever?
by Texas Wahoo on Apr 28, 2009 12:08 PM CDT up reply actions
I would...
…argue that, while it may be as strong as ever, it’s not as strong as it could be. Think about how good this conference would be if we had the improvements made by Texas, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State and Texas Tech, in addition to the continued existence of powerhouse programs in Manhattan, Lincoln and Boulder.
Oh wait, then we’d call it the SEC.
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
How do we know that UT and OU would be as strong as they are with full sharing?
Would the conference be stronger if UT, OU, A&M, and NU were slightly worse and everyone else was slightly better?
Personally, I don’t think it matters that much. We’re only talking about an extra 500k or so for the bottom schools if it were split evenly.
by Texas Wahoo on Apr 28, 2009 12:32 PM CDT up reply actions
If we are assuming...
…that the incremental difference in income each year is the reason UT and OU are as good as they are, then the incremental difference in income that would be achieved by fully equal revenue sharing should benefit the lower-income schools more. That is, if UT and OU getting an extra X number of dollars per year has made them as good as they are — granted, I’m not claiming it’s the sole reason, but you brought up the argument — then why can’t we assume that if they lost that incremental income each year, there would be some drop-off in performance, but not that much because it’s a relatively small percentage of their overall athletic department budget?
Conversely, if we assume that more revenue leads to better coaches, better facilities, better recruiting, and better performance, then the incremental gains made by the smaller schools by fully equal revenue sharing would go a long(er) way toward propping up the smaller schools, because that money would be a larger percentage of the their budget?
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
by TB on Apr 29, 2009 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions
I guess I just do not see the money having a very large effect at all
As for the money, the only way to truly make things equal would be to have the big money schools share their fundraising/marketing money, since that is where the big difference lies.
I think the biggest benefit to UT/OU is not that they get more money because they’re on TV more, it’s that they get more publicity because their on TV more. It drives recruiting and fundraising. I don’t think sharing the TV money equally would make much of a difference, but sharing the TV time equally would (which is the reason that OU sued the NCAA for antitrust violations in the first place).
Undoubtedly, the exposure is good...
…but I don’t think you can underestimate, over time, the effect that an extra $500K per year would have on schools like K-State, Iowa State, etc. When Tim Weiser was A.D. at K-State, our finances were managed brilliantly. He managed to make small upgrades to almost every facility while setting up a “rainy-day” fund that was not to be used for anything other than a complete disaster, such as a football game being canceled for a 9/11-type event. Small schools have to be more creative with the use of their money so that it’s put to maximum effect, and A.D.s like Weiser could work miracles with an extra $500K per year. Unfortunately for us, our micromanaging university president ran Weiser off, then he and his cronies blew that entire slush fund on contract buyouts for Weiser and Ron Prince.
Your point is yet another reason why I don’t understand why Texas, OU, Nebraska, and Texas A&M (the top four money schools in the conference) would fight equal revenue sharing so hard. It’s not like we’re asking for equal TV appearances, because we can’t and wouldn’t. The best teams are going to be on TV. So the big schools could keep that benefit while helping out the schools not blessed with rich slush funds for Godzillatrons, making the conference that much better as a whole.
As I’ve long thought, maybe the answer to all this is another five years or so of Texas A&M being really bad at football. Then maybe we’d get the ninth vote we need to amend the revenue-sharing agreement.
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
by TB on Apr 29, 2009 3:39 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm not sure why it's such a big deal to the bigger schools either
Perhaps it’s the principal of it – it’s the agreement they signed. Perhaps it gives each of them a little bit more assurance that none of them are going to leave the conference?
Perhaps it’s the fact that they are getting a bigger benefit than the smaller schools are losing. If Texas/OU is getting almost 10 million and there are a bunch of schools clustered around 7 million, each of those schools might only get 500k added, but Texas/OU might be lossing 2 million each. That might keep them fighting it harder. They also could be very quietly hinting at leaving if they don’t get their fair share of the money, which would likely worry schools just enough to vote for it, especially if they get slightly more money that way (A&M and Neb). And I have to imagine that Texas would be really upset if they had to share the revenue from the cable station there is talk of starting:
http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnflash/content/nov2008/db2008117_998978.htm
Also, I know Texas has a reputation for throwing money around
But I think you’d be amazed at how much Dodds manages the money. It seems like everything the money is spent on is calculated to make more money in the long-run. There was a really interested article about UT athletics (and Dodds in particular) in Texas Monthly a few months ago called Longhorns Inc.
I think Dodds...
…is an excellent AD. I wish he was still the AD at K-State. Also, I’ve met the man personally, and he is a true gentleman. You’d never know he was a millionaire in charge of one of the most powerful athletic departments in the country the way he talked to a lowly golf course employee in Manhattan three years ago.
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
by TB on Apr 29, 2009 5:20 PM CDT up reply actions
Lowly indeed.
How many times did you ask him if you could “wash his balls?”
This thread was getting way too serious…..
Introducing the new 2008 Big 12 Football Champions: OU, UT*, TT*, and MU*!
Oh and one more thing
Godzillatrons aren’t that much of a waste of money. I enjoyed it when I visited.
This is a complete waste of money.
Introducing the new 2008 Big 12 Football Champions: OU, UT*, TT*, and MU*!
I promise you Bevo will never have a $4.2 million tiara...
by Texas Wahoo on Apr 28, 2009 11:07 AM CDT up reply actions
But who's to say Boone
won’t make a $10 million belt buckle for his cowboy…..
Introducing the new 2008 Big 12 Football Champions: OU, UT*, TT*, and MU*!
At least then he's just wasting his own money
Plus, he should upgrade the cowboy’s head first. It’s pretty scary looking.
by Texas Wahoo on Apr 28, 2009 11:12 AM CDT up reply actions
One thing I want to pick up on...
…from rpt’s post is the idea that the Big 12 woke up the sleeping giants in Austin and Norman. No doubt. Over Christmas break, I was considering doing an ambitious series of posts analyzing the athletic department budgets of each school prior to the Big 12’s formation and since the Big 12’s formation. My guess, and this is an untested hypothesis, is that Texas has benefited a lot more from the Big 12 than other schools have. Alas, I don’t have the data to back that up, and I won’t absent extensive FOIA requests, but it’s something I’m curious about.
Think about it. Prior to the Big 12’s formation, Texas football had been nothing special since the days of Darrell Royal. If you don’t believe me, go to CFB Data Warehouse and check it out for yourself. Texas hadn’t won a national championship since 1970, and wasn’t even close to being mentioned in the same breath as Nebraska, Oklahoma, Miami, and Florida State through the 1980s and early 1990s. Sure, some years they went 10-1 or something, but some years they went 4-7, too. As I said, they were absolutely nothing special.
Then they jumped from the SWC, a conference that had zero exposure outside the state of Texas. They started playing in a conference with traditional powers (Nebraska and OU, even though the Sooners were down), a team that had won a national title in the 1990s (Colorado) and a team that was beginning to consistently win 10+ games each year (K-State). They added those schools in place of football wastelands like TCU, Rice and SMU. Lo and behold, a mere decade later, they are consistently winning double-digit games per year and, on the back of Vince Young, won their first national title in 35 years. If I had to make an analogy for it, I’d call it the “Independence Day” phenomenon. They move from planet-to-planet, use up the resources, and move on. I’m not saying I think Texas is going to move on any time soon, but it’s the closest I could come up with.
To address what Pan was talking about, a principled argument can be made that equal revenue sharing will make this a better conference. Unfortunately, the powers that be in Texas have a short memory and think they are the reason the Big 12 is great, rather than considering the possibility that the Big 12 played a large role in their current greatness.
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
Also, the overseer of that Texas sized athletic budget?
DeLoss Dodds – Kansas State alumni
Christ, we even have to provide you with our administrators to get it done right.
Bring on the Cats
"Without getting into specifics, my exit involves a McFlurry machine and a video tape of risque commercials from overseas." -- Jack Donaghy
Texas has certainly benefited a lot from the Big XII
It’s hard to say what would have happened if the Big XII had not been formed. Would the Big 8 be forced into signing worse TV deals that eventually left them without the funds to compete? Would the SWC have collapsed soon anyway? Would Texas and A&M have gone elsewhere?
I think it’s safe to say all of the Big XII teams have benefited by the formation – at least financially. I’m not sure if the on field success of UT is more attributable to the Big XII’s formation of the fact that Mack Brown is a great recruiter and coach. Also, Nebraska would have had to deal with Osborne’s retirement anyway, would they have transitioned better without the Texas schools in the conference?
by Texas Wahoo on Apr 28, 2009 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions
Texas also benefitted...
…from hiring the right coach. It’s just insane how important that is. All the top powers now—UT, OU, USC, UF—made a terrible hire before they made the right one. Mackovick wasn’t terrible, I guess, but they underachieved with him there. Mack Brown, however, was great. OU hired John Blake before Bob Stoops. Florida hired Ron Zook before Urban Meyer. USC hired Paul Hackett before Pete Carroll. Hell, LSU’s been good on their last two hires (Saban, Crazy Les Miles), but before that they hired Gerry DiNardo.
And on the flip side, KSU hired Bill Snyder, then Ron Prince. :-)
I always knew how important good coaches were, but it’s been made more clear recently with my trip through Mizzou history…seeing that they interviewed John Cooper and Bobby Ross before hiring Woody Widenhofer…and talked to LaVell Edwards, Pat Dye, and Joe Gibbs before settling on Warren Powers…you interview a bunch of guys, you talk about it for long periods of time, and you still have absolutely no idea whether you’re making the right hire or not. And it decides your fate for the foreseeable future.
Rock M Nation
Thrust nunchuk upward!
Texas almost hired Gary Barnett before they hired Mack Brown
The Big XII would have been a little different if that happened.
Wow...
…I mean, Barnett would have done fine, I guess, but he was not the mega-recruiter that Mack is…
Rock M Nation
Thrust nunchuk upward!
I'm going to play Devil's Advocate here...
…after first acknowledging that you are right, coaching is obviously crucially important. That’s why I’m not entirely sure that this thing isn’t cyclical at this point. In the early years of the conference, the North powers had guys like Bill Snyder, Tom Osborne, and Gary Barnett in charge. That’s a pretty impressive list. On the other hand, the South schools that are now good had guys like John Mackovick, Spike Dykes, and John Blake in charge. As I said above, any powerhouse school is only one bad coaching hire away from mediocrity, so I’m not yet convinced that this isn’t cyclical.
But as far as Mack Brown at Texas, clearly he gets great talent each year. That can’t be denied. What I wonder, however, is whether he gets that great talent because he is inherently a great recruiter, or because of Texas’ raised profile in the college football world. Back in the inconsistent days of Texas football in the late 1970s, 1980s, and early 1990s, they obviously weren’t getting good enough players to win national titles. I have to believe that was due, in part, to the fact that the SWC was not a widely regarded league. Sure, some years UT, Texas A&M, SMU (pre-death penalty) and Houston had some really good years. But on balance, it was seen as a regional league without a lot of national powerhouses. I have to believe that caused some of the really good in-state recruits to go elsewhere, like Oklahoma, or Nebraska, or Notre Dame, or Miami, or Florida State, or wherever.
However, that’s not the case anymore. Those in-state recruits can get all the national exposure they could ever want in their own backyard. Now, Mack Brown’s and his assistants’ biggest job each year is talent evaluation (and occasionally trying to beat out OU or LSU). There are more four- and five-star recruits from Texas that want to play at UT each year than UT can offer scholarships to. Is that because Mack Brown is such a great recruiter, or because Texas is a high-profile school, located in a temperate climate, in an exciting city, and offers a conference affiliation that perennially gives the player the chance to compete on the national level? The answer is probably a little bit of both.
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
by TB on Apr 29, 2009 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions
The SWC was going to break-up
I don’t think there is any way to dispute that. As a conference, it was not going to survive in the TV era. I’m not sure what would have become of the Big 8 if Texas and A&M had gone to other big conferences. Perhaps they would have been able to stay at 8 teams, perhaps they would have added other teams. In an alternative universe in which Texas joined the Pac 10 and A&M joined the SEC, who knows what would have become of any of them. But assuming both schools could have joined another major conference, they probably would have similar benefits to what they’ve enjoyed in the Big XII.
I guess I’m just saying I’m not sure it’s correct to look at whether the Big XII has allowed Texas to increase their national exposure relative to the SWC, because I think Texas was going to leave the SWC either way. Instead perhaps it should be a question of whether Texas sees better national exposure than if it were a member of the SEC.
One question, which I do not know the answer to. If Texas was not able to recruit because they lacked national standing as a member of the SWC, how did they know they would emerge with such high standing after the Big XII’s formation? Someone decided that it would be better to not share all of the TV money equally. It would seem like there was a chance Texas would be below the median in this regard.
Here is why...
…I always make this argument. I don’t think UT and TAMU had a whole lot of other options, according to this article. It sounds like Texas had tried everything, from the Big 10 to the Pac-10 to the SEC, and either got turned down (Big 10, Pac-10) or was unable to impose its will (SEC). Meanwhile, A&M was apparently holding on to some hope of getting the SEC to expand to 13 teams or have them boot somebody in order to include the Aggies. I don’t know how likely that was, but I can’t imagine the SEC going to 13 teams, and conference’s are loathe to boot a member absent strong justification (i.e., repeated and major NCAA sanctions).
I think Texas banked on the fact that playing in a conference with a higher profile than the SWC would benefit them in the long run. Every contract is essentially a bet on what the future will hold, and UT’s bet was that a conference with more national recognition than the SWC would benefit them eventually. Of course there is a chance UT would have ended up on the short end of that stick, but as it turned out, they weren’t. Shrewd move by the folks in Austin.
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
by TB on Apr 29, 2009 3:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Did Arkansas join the SEC before the SWC dissolved?
Hail to the Purple, Hail to the White
Wildcat in spirit, Wildcat in fight
Hail Alma Mater from sea to sea
Onward forever, Hail Victory!
Google says Arkansas left SWC for SEC in 1991...
SWC dissolved in 1996.
Hail to the Purple, Hail to the White
Wildcat in spirit, Wildcat in fight
Hail Alma Mater from sea to sea
Onward forever, Hail Victory!
Yes
Arkansas left for the SEC in 1990.
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
by TB on Apr 29, 2009 4:29 PM CDT up reply actions
That article certainly suggests that the SEC was an option that UT didn't want
I don’t know what you mean by the “unable to impose its will” comment. I love that article by the way. Great writing.
In repsponse to MadCat, Arkansas left the SWC in 1990, which basically the SWC towards dissolution.
I meant the heightened academic standards...
…the article says that UT wanted higher academic standards in a conference that featured only two AAU universities, but the SEC was uninterested in raising academic standards. In the Big 12, UT was able to impose its will on raising academic standards, forcing Nebraska to do away with the partial qualifiers that had been so integral to their success over the years.
And I agree with you about that article. The reported did an excellent job of digging into the story and finding out what really happened, then presenting it in an interesting manner.
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats
by TB on Apr 29, 2009 4:33 PM CDT up reply actions
I see what you were saying now
Although I believe the bigger issue of academic standards was not for the football program, but for the universities as a whole. The article mentions how the SEC only had 2 members in the AAU (while the Big 8 had 5). UT did not want to be associated with LSU, Miss State, Georgia; they wanted to be associated with Missouri, Colorado, Iowa State, etc. That is why the University really wanted to join the Big Ten even though the geography doesn’t make sense. To be associated with Michigan, Illionis, Wisconsin, etc.
As for the partial qualifiers, I don’t see why that isn’t taken on by the NCAA in the first place.
Great link... loved the article..
And to be honest, I think there is enough meat there for a book. I know I’d buy it.
I would, too...
…I think a person could write a helluva book examining everything that went into the Big 12’s formation.
Maybe we should see if Peter is interested in dropping that lucrative legal career that awaits him…
We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats











