K-State/Iowa State to Arrowhead?

by TB on Aug 20, 2008 12:35 PM CDT Comment 14 comments

While perusing the news this morning, I found this quick missive from Austin Meek's blog at the TCJ. Apparently, there's a possibility that K-State and Iowa State may move their football games to Arrowhead Stadium in Kansas City.

My initial reaction was something along the lines of "[t]hat would be fucking stupid." But I sat around and thought about it a little bit, and while I'm still not sold that this is a good idea, there may be some reasons to support it.

First, I thought it was stupid because I don't see any reason to have a special setup for the K-State/ISU game. The Clones are not a rival program. There's no 'history' between the two schools. Not since 2002, when Seneca Wallace got depantsed by the K-State defense, have I looked at the game with ISU with anything resembling great anticipation. I could look at a special setup with Colorado (K-State games at Arrowhead, CU games at Invesco High field or whatever they call it these days), as something worth looking at, but Iowa State? Uhh, OK.

On top of that, I'm assuming this means K-State will be giving up a home conference game in the near future. I know that Arrowhead has (a lot) more seats than Bill's House, but there's no guarantee we'll sell as many tickets in Arrowhead as we would at a home game. In fact, there's at least a decent chance won't make as much money on this, unless the Kansas City Chiefs are guaranteeing us some minimum payout. And all that says nothing of the Manhattan businesses who are certain to be monumentally pissed off about losing a weekend of Wildcat football.

So those are the negatives, in my eyes. But when I thought about it, this may not be such a bad move after all. With the caveat mentioned above, this could be a good financial move. Arrowhead provides a lot more seats, and I'm guessing we're looking at a payout for the year the game is a "home game" for Iowa State, which would be a bonus.

Also, though maybe not especially vocally on here, I've been a bit critical of K-State's presence in the Kansas City metro area. Put simply, I don't believe we've been sufficiently marketing ourselves in the City of Fountains, and the KC Star certainly isn't picking up the slack. On top of that, the two schools that dominate KC in terms of total alums have significantly improved in football while we've taken a significant step back. We need to make sure we don't completely lose our presence in KC to those two schools. Playing a game at Arrowhead could be a very good method of increasing our visibility in KC.

Finally, when I thought about the "nothing special" nature of our series with Iowa State, I realized that was in some ways a flawed argument. While KU and MU have a long, bloody rivalry, their football rivalry didn't register a blip on the national radar until this year. Last season excepted, it's been 13 years since KU had any national relevance, and it's been 29 years since MU had any national relevance. (On a side note, it sure is fun to watch the two schools fight about who has more, or more accurately, less football tradition) So while the K-State/ISU series has never had anything resembling national implications, neither did the Border War prior to last season. And though KC may not be a natural second home for Iowa State or, to a lesser extent, K-State, we damn sure aren't going to move our series to Des Moines just for the sake of having a special neutral-site game. Does Drake even play football?

Anyway, those are my initial and semi-revised thoughts on the issue. Yours?

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No, no, and no

I’m sorry, but I feel that the cons strongly outweigh the pros in this situation.

1. Attendance – Our fans haven’t exactly been great when it comes to attendance. If we’re not selling out 50,000 – we’re not going to sell out 80,000. I know we have to factor in the ISU fans, but we also have to assume that many of our western Kansas Catbackers won’t be driving the extra two hours each way.

2. Perception – We’d be setting ourselves up to once again be compared to KU, and I’m NEVER okay with that. I don’t want KU or MU thinking anyone wants to be like them. Furthermore, refering back to point #1, if we don’t sell as many tickets as those two teams, it will look bad.

3. Our fair city – Manhattan prospers because of the buzz around K-State sporting events. Traveling to other Big 12 towns is a lot of fun too. Let’s let home games BE home games, and away games BE away games.

4. Incentive – Neutral sites should be left for bowl games and conference championship. It should be something, in my opinion, our boys have to work hard for.

PROUD & PURPLE

by ksubailey on Aug 20, 2008 12:57 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Bleh

I get where you’re coming from TB, and I agree about the KC stuff, but playing Iowa State is like playing some WAC team. You should be able to beat them, and if you don’t, it means you aren’t very good and should be somewhat embarrassed.

Iowa State fans usually show the emotion of Paris Hilton during coitus, so consider me thrilled to see 15,000 of their fans drive down to KC to sit on their hands.

Hell, half of the people there in red and gold will probably be Chiefs fans wanting to see a real football game in Arrowhead for a change.

by Panjandrum on Aug 20, 2008 3:48 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

A bit graphic

on the Hilton comment…..nice.

Man do I hate Longhorn fans, well except for the ones that actually went there.

by mystman995 on Aug 20, 2008 8:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

ISU brought 40,000 the last time they played in KC

It was a great atmosphere too. Just an fyi.

by Pauli on Aug 21, 2008 5:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

H O R R I B L E

The rampant march of money over everything else that was sacred about college sports continues. College games should be played in college stadiums, as close to college campuses as possible. KU v. MU in Arrowhead is dumb, and so is this.

K-State already charges too much money to get into its games – evidenced by a sub-full stadium every week. Unless this is a strategy to lower season ticket prices by eliminating a home game, I don’t get it.

Moving the home games out of Manhattan only punishes the local business that they want to bilk for more and more advertising dollars every year. Hotels in Manhattan are already having a hard enough time making a go of it. Eliminating a huge percentage of their yearly income will not help.

You know, an athletic department does not exist without a team, a team does not exist without fans, fans do not exist if you keep jerking them around.

by CPNE on Aug 20, 2008 4:03 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

This is college football right?

So keep it at the COLLEGES! I’m pissed at the idea of moving a home game away from the fans. The reason this sport is so great is because of the atmosphere the home stadiums create. Preseason (BCA Classic 2003) and bowl games should be the only “neutral site” games.

Man do I hate Longhorn fans, well except for the ones that actually went there.

by mystman995 on Aug 20, 2008 8:39 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

And it's official.

The Cats will play IA State starting in the 2009 season. The school will make a nice chunk of change. The city of Manhattan will not…

Man do I hate Longhorn fans, well except for the ones that actually went there.

by mystman995 on Aug 21, 2008 8:38 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

It's amazing...

…we agree with Bob Lutz. Although for entirely different reasons. And it’s nice to see that Lutz is keeping up his proud tradition of hypocrisy and poor justifications. For example:

“…this series has the appearance of K-State, especially, trying to keep up with the Joneses. If, that is, the Joneses are really named the Kansas Jayhawks…”

Yes, Bob, KU and every other school that has more money to spend on athletics than K-State.

“Both schools (KU and MU) have large alumni bases in Kansas City.”

I’m guessing KC is the largest or second-largest base of K-State alumni. ISU alums probably tend to end up in Des Moines, but I’ve seen plenty of them this summer in KC.

“It’s (KC) close to being a midway point for the schools (KU and MU).”

KC is no more a midway point between Lawrence and Columbia than it is Manhattan and Ames. It’s 120 miles from Manhattan to KC, and another 230 from KC to Ames. It’s 40 miles from Lawrence to KC, and another 120 from KC to Columbia. Look at those ratios.

“A ton of current Kansas (he means KU) students grew up in KC; ditto for Missouri students.”

I don’t think I’ve ever seen a JoCo license plate at K-State, have any of you?

“Playing this game in a bigger venue doesn’t give it more cache. It’s Kansas State-Iowa State and unless one or both shows a lot of improvement between now and then, the game will be pretty marginal in its importance.”

The exact same could have been said of KU-MU at the time they decided to move the series to Arrowhead.

“It’s called selling out.”

You heard it here first. Lew Perkins is a sellout.

We'll carry the banner high!

by TB on Aug 21, 2008 8:59 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

D'oh!

And how could I miss the obvious misuse of the English language by Lutz?

“Playing this game in a bigger venue doesn’t give it more cache.”

Really? Playing a game in a bigger venue doesn’t mean it’s concealed or hidden? Or, perhaps, you meant “cachet,” Bob?

We'll carry the banner high!

by TB on Aug 21, 2008 9:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's not nice for you to make fun of the disabled...

Obviously, Bob Lutz is on some sort of work-program with the Eagle due to his disability.

You should be ashamed of yourself. Making fun of the retarded….boo.

by Panjandrum on Aug 21, 2008 10:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

You're right

Lord, I apologize.

We'll carry the banner high!

by TB on Aug 21, 2008 10:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ah don't tease the man

He made some good points. And to criticize your criticism, I believe he was talking about the Border War as a point of example for his arguments. You looked into this way to far.

Wait a minute, did I just stand up for ‘Lutz the Putz’?

Man do I hate Longhorn fans, well except for the ones that actually went there.

by mystman995 on Aug 21, 2008 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think Lutz's points were decent because...

they’re common sense.

You don’t schedule a game at a pro stadium with a perennial cellar dweller.

Don’t get me wrong, I’ll go, but only because I’m stoked to pay $25 to park at Arrowhead.

This is not an occult science. This is not one of those crazy systems of divination and astrology. That stuff's hooey, and you've got to have a screw loose to go in for that sort of thing. Our beliefs are fairly commonplace and simple to understand. Humankind is simply materialized color operating on the 49th vibration. You would make that conclusion walking down the street or going to the store.

by Panjandrum on Aug 21, 2008 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm surprised that other blogs/web sites

haven’t given a little attention to how ridiculous this is. I know I’d be poking fun if Baylor and Oklahoma State decided to play a few games in the Cotton Bowl.

Man do I hate Longhorn fans, well except for the ones that actually went there.

by mystman995 on Aug 21, 2008 1:48 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs